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20th January 2012, 06:23 PM
#181
Senior Member
Senior Hubber
Btw coming to Oh Prema Devathe , i too concur with Kv
The Ri2 is hardly there . In the Pallavi it is not at all there and there is just a strand of it during the interludes and Charanam.
I feel its just an alien note and so dont feel its Neethimathi
I also feel there is a Graha Bedham happening during the place Prema Vahini at 02:40 where the notes are heard as Pa Sa Ni2 Pa Pa Da2 , i feel the shift takes place at Ga2 where the Ga2 is made to look like the Sa , but as Kv has pointed out the notes are played as da Ga2 Ri2 da-da-ni
The structure goes along the lines Sa Ga2 Ma2 Pa Da3 Ni3 Sa | Sa Ni3 Da3 Pa Ma3 Ga2 Sa
Searching in Wiki Janya List , there is not a single raaga having this structure
Whatever the raga is , there is no denying that this is an outstanding number.
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20th January 2012 06:23 PM
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20th January 2012, 06:24 PM
#182
Senior Member
Senior Hubber
Vel and others ,
Why is Pahaadi and Mohanam always confusing ?
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20th January 2012, 06:25 PM
#183
Senior Member
Devoted Hubber
Originally Posted by
vel
Hi Suresh, RR, Vinatha --i think swapnangal is pahadi with some sivaranjani touches in charanams. To understand why would he mix those scales, one would need to understand the film situation better.
-- on similar lines this rickshaw mama song (1992) is pahadi with the sivaranjani touches......
Last edited by vel; 20th January 2012 at 06:30 PM.
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20th January 2012, 06:25 PM
#184
Senior Member
Veteran Hubber
skr,
I am not too sure if 'en kutham' can be classified as Todi. I think the initial portions do have a touch of the Todi scale (not the raga I would say). The two lines from 'vellimanal' in the charanam seems to clearly be SindhuBhairavi. It again changes. A small piece which is played on mandolin (I think) gives me a feeling that Raja has used a middle eastern mode. It may be that the whole melody will adhere to a middle eastern scale. (My blog plug and reference: A ragam similar to Todi played in Azerbaijan: http://sureshs65music.blogspot.com/2...ani-thodi.html
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20th January 2012, 08:34 PM
#185
Administrator
Diamond Hubber
Originally Posted by
skr
RR ,
Whenever i get a doubt regarding Ri Ga Da Ni,i hum the doubt song and a popular song say Katril Endhan Geetham which i know is in Keeravani and has D1 and N3.
Will try to see if i could do a mapping as to whether its the same D1 or N3 in the doubt song and then try to match accordingly.
Interesting.. but seems too tough for me.
KV: you can try with MS Word cut & paste, but it's not too reliable in my experience. Simple would be to take a screen shot and post it.
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20th January 2012, 08:44 PM
#186
Senior Member
Senior Hubber
Suresh ,
I think you could be right with En Kutham.
I thought its Thodi coz i felt the song seems to have only the Ri1 throughout. But like you said , it seems to have a stronger Sindhu Bhairavi flavour.
Nice to listen to the Azerbaijani Thodi once again
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20th January 2012, 08:53 PM
#187
Senior Member
Veteran Hubber
Thank you guys for giving some valuable tips on identifying the swaras. You guys are amazing! Wonderful discussions
I know some 25-30 raagams and a reference (krithi, or an old song or IR song) song in each raagam. If they happens to cross I am lucky, but I know it is a very crude way of identifying raagams. Just wanted to know a better way to identify the raagams and the swaras. It seems, I will have to start trying on my keyboard (little lazy to do that) rather than the above method. Generally, the beauty in the tune and the feel are the one which captures me the most, followed by orchestration. While I admire these two aspects, I forget the other things like raagam. Need to expand my horizons. Thanks again for the valuable tips.
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20th January 2012, 09:18 PM
#188
Senior Member
Seasoned Hubber
just curious to know, ippo etho oru kavithaiyai summa ittukatti raagathoda (??!!!) paadina athu oru raagathula irukkumar illa kenathanama irukkuma? I think some MDs (?) may be doing like this
Sorry for this kenathanama kelvi
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20th January 2012, 10:55 PM
#189
Senior Member
Platinum Hubber
Originally Posted by
San_K
just curious to know, ippo etho oru kavithaiyai summa ittukatti raagathoda (??!!!) paadina athu oru raagathula irukkumar illa kenathanama irukkuma? I think some MDs (?) may be doing like this
Sorry for this kenathanama kelvi
I don't think this is a kEnaththanamAna kostin. Me too have the same doubt (and a novice assumption as answer also ).
With 7 (+5 sharp / flat) per octave alone, you have tremendous permutations / combinations, especially if you consider the fact that there is practically no limit to the "bar". For e.g, take this peculiar word "supercalifragilisticexpialidocious" (a song from Mary Poppins), that has around 15 syllables, on theory can be assigned 15 notes and that makes, again by simple arith, 15*12 (ok 15*7 at least) combinations. While most of them may not be pleasant to listen - regardless of the tempo changes or octave changes, they are possibilities and by IR's theory of 'nAi kuRaikkiRadhum isai dhAn', they are "music".
However, not many of them can fall under the "defined swara combos" of scales or rAgAs. There may be technical terms in musical grammar to explain them (foreign note, bEdham etc) but the simple novice conclusion of mine is "not all mettukkaL will conform to a known rAgam".
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20th January 2012, 11:01 PM
#190
Senior Member
Platinum Hubber
Also, going by IR's statement on 'mayilE mayilE' - "சுத்தமான ஹம்சத்வனி ராகத்தில் அமைந்த பாடல்" , there are 100's of songs out there that are not "சுத்தம்" but "அசுத்தம்" if one goes strictly by rAgA conformity alone
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