Protectionism

[rajraj]

I don't know how this can happen. Is it because of India being a service oriented economy?. Please elaborate

Global economy has a downside for developing countries like India. India will feel it ten or fifteen years from now. By that time it will be too late to do anything.

af, sarna : To underestand why I said that you have to follow what is being harped about in India:

" India will be a superpower by 20xx"

You can replace 'xx' with 20,30,40,50,.............

What does it take for a country to become a superpower?

It must be

-an economic power
-a leader in science and
-a leader in technology

India is not a superpower in economy even in Asia - Japan and China are.

We have not produced a Nobel prize winner in science since C.V.Raman. The other two winners, Chandrasekar and Ramakrishnan, won for work done outside India

We are nowhere near becoming a leader in technology. We are just a manufacturing wing for leaders in technology. But, we had the opportunity to take the initiative in technology. We missed the boat. When MNCs were allowed to operate in India there should have been some demands by the Indian government, specically to establish research centers/labs in India. They would have done it because India had/has cheap technical labor with fluency in English. But, the golden opportunity was missed.

I hear that IBM has established a research lab in IIT,Delhi campus with a budget of $50 million. That is peanuts for IBM. In the US they spend about $6 billion on R &D, about 6% of their revenue, if I remember correctly. India should have demanded that they spend 6% of their revenue from software develped in India on research labs.

Of course, India does not produce enough Ph.Ds to staff the research labs.

In one year China produced 22000 Ph.Ds and India produced less than 9000. China has a strategy for science and technology. India does not have one ( not that I know of).

What was the reason India produced less Ph.Ds than China? We have more brain power than China. But, most of that brain goes to IT sector, a waste in my opinion.

Most of the IT jobs do not require a degree in engineering or computer science. Any college graduate can be trained to be a software techie. I met four such techies here - lawyer, M.Sc in Geology, M.Sc in Genetics and a B.Sc !

In fact, that was how it was in the 50s and 60s. IBM used to take graduates with degrees in arts - economics, history, psychology, literature etc, give them a test called programmer aptitude test and if they passed they were given six months training. If they did well they were given a probationary title to work with an experienced programmer. Those were days when we had only a few high level languages - FORTRAN,PL/1,COBOL and APL( an internal language) and low level languages known as assembly language and machine language. Assembly language used mnemonics for instructions and machine language used hexadecimal numbers. But, those arts majors did well in those languages.

Now you have a number of higher level languages and you don't have to struggle with hexadecimal numbers to speed up execution.
It should be easy to train those with degrees in arts or sciences.
In fact you could train a high school graduate to do that. My youngest son wrote a compiler as part of a CS course in high school.

By diverting intelligent and creative people to IT sector we are short changing science. I think the government realizes that and is doing something. But, it is too little.

IBM has research labs in the US,Switzerland and Japan. I hear they have opened in some other counries also.

Why is it Indian IT majors do not have research labs? Why is it they do not branch into other areas to make India a leader in Science and Technology?

I hope you understand what I am getting at or where I am coming from?

(I said some of this in some other thread, the title of which I don't remember. )

There is more. I will post periodically! Hope you don't get bored. This hub is for fun, not for serious topics!

[rajraj]

When MNCs were allowed to operate in India there should have been some demands by the Indian government, specically to establish research centers/labs in India. They would have done it because India had/has cheap technical labor with fluency in English. But, the golden opportunity was missed.

I said this on Sep 14th. Today there is a news item in Wall Street Journal that talks about China demanding cutting edge electric vehicle technology in return for cheap labor for manufacturing those vehicles in China. That is how it should be.

Here is the link to the article:

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB1000...368918268.html

When India is ruled by wimps who have no vision, no foresight and no guts you get nothing in return for supplying cheap labor except wages. You saw how they handled Bhopal disaster and the recent nuclear disaster liability bill. And India wants to be super power? Who says you can not dream?

[ajithfederer]

That's pretty shocking.
Thanks for bringing this article here sir. It's high time we start a news thread for Business Issues around the world.

When MNCs were allowed to operate in India there should have been some demands by the Indian government, specically to establish research centers/labs in India. They would have done it because India had/has cheap technical labor with fluency in English. But, the golden opportunity was missed.

I said this on Sep 14th. Today there is a news item in Wall Street Journal that talks about China demanding cutting edge electric vehicle technology in return for cheap labor for manufacturing those vehicles in China. That is how it should be.

Here is the link to the article:

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB1000...368918268.html

When India is ruled by wimps who have no vision, no foresight and no guts you get nothing in return for supplying cheap labor except wages. You saw how they handled Bhopal disaster and the recent nuclear disaster liability bill. And India wants to be super power? Who says you can not dream?

[ajithfederer]

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB1000..._WSJ_US_News_5

The chinese are not bulging yet while Washington is pressing for punitive actions against China in trade circles.

[rajraj]

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424052748703440604575495733696520818.html?m od=WSJ_WSJ_US_News_5

The chinese are not budging yet while Washington is pressing for punitive actions against China in trade circles.

That is known as growing a 'Frankestein'! Nothing new for the US !

[rajraj]

If you think IBM is all about computers, peripherals and computer related services read the article in this link:

http://news.cnet.com/8301-13772_3-20012306-52.html

There is no reason why the IT majors in India can not open similar research labs! It takes national pride,short in India! Remember it was Jamshedhi Tata who founded IISc because the British were happy churning out B.As to be clerks!

[ajithfederer]

Anand Sharma turns the table on the U.S.

Describing the State of Ohio's ban on offshore outsourcing by government departments as ‘ill-advised', India has ‘firmly' conveyed to the U.S. its displeasure over the move and other protectionist measures such as the hike in visa fees for professionals.

“We have put it firmly in our discussions. I feel that the U.S. has seriously registered India's viewpoint as well as concerns of the Indian IT industry. We do hope there will be timely and appropriate responses,” Indian Commerce and Industry Minister Anand Sharma told reporters here on Tuesday after his meeting with top U.S. officials, including Trade Representative Ron Kirk.

Mr. Sharma was here to attend the Trade Policy Forum (TPF) meet, which is the principle trade dialogue platform between the U.S. and India.

Citing the example of the recent Airtel-IBM deal, Mr. Sharma turned the table on the U.S., stating, “Airtel, an Indian company, has placed orders of $3.5 billion on IBM. Isn't that outsourcing? Where would those jobs be created? Where (would) those jobs would be supported?”

The largest orders for Boeing aircraft had also been placed by India. “How many jobs would have been sustained and how many jobs would be created?,” he asked.

Referring to the ban on government offshore outsourcing, he said, “We hope that there is no other State which would follow the ill-advised and less informed path chosen by the Ohio state government.”

He said at a time when the global economy was reeling from the aftershocks of the economic crisis and was coming out of a recession, any inward-looking step of protectionism would slow down the pace of recovery.

“It is better to avoid it, particularly since the U.S. is the world leader, is the largest economy and, therefore, there are expectations (from it) in that context,” he said.

Under the Border Security law, the U.S. had in August hiked the fees for H-1B and L1 visas by at least $2,000 for the next five years. Indian professionals, particularly in the IT sector, use these visas for short-term contracts in the U.S., which account for about 60 per cent of Indian software exports of $50 billion.

The two sides also discussed the issue of a Totalisation Agreement, under which the Indians on short-term jobs would not have to pay the social security tax in the U.S. Since they do not stay there for long, they are not able to use the benefit of the social security in return for the taxes.

Keywords: Trade Policy Forum, Ohio, outsourcing ban, Airtel-IBM deal, Border Security law, visa fee hike


http://www.thehindu.com/business/Ind...icle741953.ece

The hi-lited portions speak some sense .

[rajraj]

af: Here is the link for Bharti Airtel-IBM deal

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB1000...194524802.html

This is for Airtel's IT operations in African countries. I supect they will send IBM(India) employees to those countries in addtion to hiring locally. I don't think it will create jobs in the US. I heard that IBM is planning to increase the workforce in India to 100K employees! It appears as though Sharma has not gotten all the facts right. I will talk to some IBMers here to see what is going on! I stay informed about what happens in IBM !

Boeing order is a necessity. It is a choice between Airbus and Boeing! India does not have the technology and it did not care to develop the technology.

[ajithfederer]

Appadiyae Konjam boeing deal pathiyum solllunga sir .

And Yes IBM is increasing its work force in India laying off many here. But Regarding Boeing isn't that the case with most of the countries?. I mean you only have Boeing or Airbus. That's it right?. All the countries in the world go for one of these two right?./

[rajraj]

Appadiyae Konjam boeing deal pathiyum solllunga sir .

And Yes IBM is increasing its work force in India laying off many here.

I edited my post to include Boeing deal!

A country should stand on its own legs. We had 60 years as an independent country and we did not act! See Japan devastated after WW II and where it is now! Independence means independence from imported jobs also!