Occult & Metaphysics

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Hi! I'm going to try and do a long post this morning, continuing what I wrote previously about the mind and creating what you want:

Anyone can draw good things to himself once he understands the inner workings of his own mind, just as anyone can swim across a pool once he learns the laws of swimming. The mind is like an ocean - it has a surface and it has depths, vast, "impenetrable" depths full of mystery below the surface. No one can tell where the surface ends and the depths begin. But the ocean is all ONE mass of water, indivisible, ONE. The human mind is the same, all ONE but there are TWO distinctly different types of activities carried on within it. The failure to grasp the difference in these two activities is what causes all the confusion in life.

You must learn to work in harmony with your deeper nature. You do not have two minds but TWO PHASES of ONE mind, two spheres of activity in which the mind operaties in two different ways:

Surface Mind - your objective, conscious mind, selecting and initiating, "I choose"

Deeper Mind - Your subjective, subconscious mind, fabricating, "I obey"

Surface mind consciously directs you when you are learning to play the piano until, through repetition, you become so familiar with piano technique that individual finger movements have passed into the deeper mind, leaving the surface mind free for reading the score, singing words or even carrying on a conversation. Surface mind is the directing mind - "I choose" - all choices are made by the surface mind.

Deeper mind - the creating, the manufacturing phase of mind. Takes what Surface Mind gives and turns thoughts into things - both good and bad - into the outward conditions of our lives. IT HAS NO POWER OF CHOICE. It never reasons, it cannot refuse to take what Surface Mind gives it. Like the soil, that must accept any seed, it must accept any thought. Deeper Mind is habitual mind. Whatever we entertain often enough and vividly enough in our Surface Mind eventually passes into Deeper Mind where it continues to act automatically.

People are not born optimistic ot pessimistic, they learn to be what they are. Whatever you desire to be, you may become by the same procedure you use to learn to play the piano or to swim.

Deeper Mind brings choice into form. Deeper Mind has access to infinite resources, it knows how to heal any condition effortlessly. All healing - body or affairs - all success, all prosperity, all mastery over destructive habits is produced within Deeper Mind before appearing in outer manifestation.

Deeper Mind is the storehouse of experience. It is one with the infinite mind. Deeper Mind has complete, unswerving obedience to Surface Mind. It has no power to choose; it can only obey. All its vast knowledge and creative power are dedicated to the person who learns how to use it.

The loom doesn't care what it weaves, it is impersonal. It has no choice but to weave whatever threads are given it according to the pattern set by the weaver. The weaver is responsible for the result. The loom has only one task - to keep weaving. The weaver does not say, "Why have you done this to me?" if he is displeased by what he sees coming out of the loom. He knows that the only place where beauty can be made to replace ugliness is on the rack of spools at his end, before the obedient weaving apparatus gets it, and so he changes the threads.

Summary: Deeper Mind is the working, producing phase of mind, Surface Mind is the choosing, selecting phase of mind. Surface Mind CHOOSES what shall come into the life but is helpless to produce it. Deeper Mind is the only agent in the universe that can bring that choice into manifestation.

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OOOOoooooopsss donna....

such a long post!:O and surprsingly sweet after a loooong time!!

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mmc-
i missed you, too!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

We must cultivate the quiet assurance of an infinite healing presence within.

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Donna,

How are u?? finding it difficult to write much here..as this requires some peaceful setting....however reproducing one of Milton's posts here as it shows some practices of Tamil Chrisitians which are very interesting..my aim is probably we can archive this thread at a later date and can present it to those who want to know more on Occult and Metaphysics:

In our day to day christian life in TN ,we are more like Hindus in practices like Kalyanam ,karumaathi etc etc.If you come close and watch you can clearly notice How the Tamil christian minds are still with our old Hindu culture .Non-catholics always blame catholics for they are giving much importance to Saints ,which is true practically ,but not true in church point of view .According to church sanits cannot be worshiped .GOD only deserves for worship.That is why when we pray to saints including Mary ,we pray "Pray For us"(Engalukkaga Vendikollungal),because we belive saints will bring our prayers to GOD .But in practical life many catholics even worshiped saints and giving much importance to saints than Jesus .

In our hindu culture ,we have many gods for many kind of requests .For example 'Intha Pillayara kumpitta Kulanthai pirakkum' ,'Intha aanjaneyara kumpitta Velai kidaikkum' .The same mentality is also with Tamil(as well as other Indian christians) Christians .You can notice people say "Joseph is for education' ,Anthoniyar(St.Antony) is powerful in destroying Satan' etc..You can see many people(Pei Pidiththavar) are staying in St.Antony's Church .Some of them mistakenly beleive St,Antony is authorosed for destroying satan .But church says everything is done by GOD ,may be through prayers of saints .

There is a funny story in our village..
Once the movie 'Karunaamoorthy' (Story of Jesus)was screened in our village.When Jesus was tied with cross by soldiers and Jesus was in Pain ,one old lady shouted 'Anthoniyare!(St.Antony) .Enga Yesu Naathara Kaappaththunga!".

I will come with more later...

Its nice to know such new information..even though i was all along living in Tamilnadu, i never knew such practices of Tamil Christians.Lets hope that Milton writes more on this.

It will be also interesting if someone writes on the sufi practices of Tamilnadu.

I read a wonderful story recently:

http://www.geocities.com/hadeen_ncr/writing/visham.html

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Reproduction:

"Pradheep,

Nice to see your posts....

There are some issues i think in which u mingle different streams and get confused.Sorry for being impolite.

I am also a novice to this field, yet let me point out as to what i think is the position as held out by Hindu think-tanks:

The concept for Salvation for all happens at the time of the Eternal Dissolution as denoted by the "Oozhi perum koothu" of Shiva.There is this view that the entire creation, animate and inanimate things merge into the Creator.

If i remember correctly, Sarada Devi had a vision in which She sees this and mentions that the entire creation will go into the void(sometimes represented by Kali in Hindu mythology).

But the concept of Mukti(liberation from this cycle of birth and death...or Veedu peru or Piravi perunkadal neenthuthal of Saint.VAlluvar) in this life is something for which one has to work towards....it ofcourse invloves trascending the duality....and for which we are supposed to come out of both good and bad.You have rightly pointed out that there is nothing such as good and bad before God, but its a Vedantic concept meant for those following the Gnana Marga.

We have this mixing the different streams ...and my personal feeling is that it will not do a sadhak good.

This is the reason that the Vedantic concepts appear after the karma kanda of Vedas.Vedanta itself means end part of vedas(anta-end).Only after one disciplines the mind and ego by striving one is supposed to deliberate on such non-duality concepts.

Otherwise the mind is so clevar that it will start twisting and will mislead us.We see friends who are full of ego declaring that they are following the Vedanta and follow their own ways and
they like claiming that there is no good and bad before God.

If you see even in Yoga , the iyama ,niyamas come first...only after you discipline yourself, you are supposed to practice higher practices.

The same thing applies to Tantric practices in which the things that sadhaks abhor, lead them to enlightenment.We see Osho type of persons suggesting Sex as a means to still the mind, mentioning the ancient practices(even Thirumoolar devotes an entire chapter on this as to how during the sexual act, by focussing the mind on some Chakras on the forehead etc).But many convenieantly forget the fact that these practices are suggested for those who follow a rigid celebate life and overcome the sensual attractions.Infact these are linked with Hatha Yoga and the higher forms of Hatha Yoga requires a highly disciplined celebate life.

Infact only Bhakti Yoga advocates simple procedures like prayers, bhajans, repetition of Mantras and meditation ....and to a large extent this method can be followed without the guidance of a Guide...the other methods are very complicated and for the genearal populace, there is every possibility that these can be misinterpreted or misused.

Perhaps this is the reason that our forefathers called this as Maraiporul.Once a friend of mine pointed out that almost all great Masters had an inner circle to which they gave these things and to the general public they advocated simple prayers and some rules.Perhaps this could be the reason.

I think that Jesus Christ couldve also dont the same thing.If you see, He doesnt talk of celibacy as a prerequiste....but His direct disciples have all been celebates, perhaps i think that they mightve been asked to follow various practices which are similar to that of the Hindu Yogis....

The Revelation chapter talks of Seven Stars, light, sound of Water etc..this denotes that some similarity with the Yogic practices where one sees inner light, the seven chakras on the spinal chord(some say this is denoted as cross etc), the sound of many waters(aum or amen)..."

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Dear karthikdevan
Nothing was clear from your post. What is that you are conveying?.

>>>>We see friends who are full of ego declaring that they are following the Vedanta >>>
I know it was directed to me. Please tell me where am I wrong. Did you read the gita and bible thread.

>>>>>There are some issues i think in which u mingle different streams and get confused>>>
What did I mix up?. Can we discuss?

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>>>>We see friends who are full of ego declaring that they are following the Vedanta >>>

That was a general comment.Not directed at you.

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I have Swami Vivekananda news! I read in the Indian Express that the Vivekananda Vedanta Society of Chicago is going to build his "Temple Universal" on 15 acres of land near Chicago. It is due to be completed in 2005 and sounds like it will be really amazing! That is just one hour by air from Rochester so maybe I might even go sometime.

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WE have this worship of Ether as one of the five primordial elements of this creation.We have the Shiva Lingam of Chidambaram which is said to denote to worshipping the Akash(ether).

Surprisingly , i came across this dialogue which shows similar concepts in pre-christian Europe:

And they allowed Apollonius to ask questions;
and he asked them of what they thought the cosmos was composed;
but they replied:
"Of elements."

"Are there then four" he asked.

"Not four," said Iarchas, "but five."

"And how can there be a fifth," said Apollonius,
"alongside of water and air and earth and fire ?"

"There is the ether", replied the other,
"which we must regard as the stuff of which gods are made;
for just as all mortal creatures inhale tbe air,
so do immortal and divine natures inhale the ether."

Apollonius again asked which was the first of the elements,
and Iarchas answered:

"All are simultaneous, for a living creature is not born bit by bit."

"Am I," said Apollonius, "to regard
the universe as a living creature?"

"Yes," said the other, "if you have a sound knowledge of it,
for it engenders all living things."

- The Life of Apollonius of Tyana, Philostratus, 220AD.

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This is an interesting site http://www.headless.org/