Break through In Indian civilization studies.

[Oldposts]

Topic started by V (@ 202.159.225.118) on Tue Oct 19 12:35:25 EDT 2004.


Breakthrough into the Mysteries of Indian Civilization
The ancient civilization of this country has a record of 5000-7000
years of archeology in the form of epigraphs, artifacts, and
monuments Etc. It also has tradition and belief running to timeless
past. Literature Record dating to 3000 years at least in Two
languages that is Sanskrit and Tamil. Myths of time immemorial and
Oral tradition apart.
This country has been the land of confluence of various forces the
Gods, Demons etc. This country has also been the pioneer of
civilization, of knowledge, of Gurus, of Incarnations, a way of life
on earth, a path finder.
Such a country has also been banned by influence of feudalism and
its values and isolation of common man and oppression against him.
Seeds of such a dichotomy were sowed in early Sanskrit writings
which language had been appropriated by the elite the ruling class
who were grouped as Arya (Nobles) Though they do not form a race
during the initial stages they consolidated slowly during the
medieval period.
The distortion created by the varna- ashrama dharma with varied
interpretation had been the root cause hate in the current day
society.
This apart the story of Indian civilization takes us to the Indus
valley which is the first known settlement thus far though more
explorations are revealing settlements across the subcontinent
during a period earlier to this. A complete biography of this
civilization could be written but for the mystery of the script that
reveals it.Early attempts to reveal it pointed to Dravidian
settlements though this had been contested right through by Aryan
lobby. The missing link continues to be an area of distortion and
exploitation by various interested group who would like to
appropriate the civilization. While the entire Sanskrit literature
is abound by Dichotomy of Indian culture reflecting dominance of one
over the other efforts are on in pioneering works of Dr.Loganathan
to set things right.
The discovery of Sumerian as Archaic Tamil is a breakthrough in this
direction Efforts are also on to unravel the Indus script as Proto-
Tamil. A new ground has been laid in retrieving Sanskrit into its
base Tamil. It is being concluded that it is only a stream of Tamil.
Let us now begin with realising Sumerian as Archaic Tamil:
Quote
[The more he knows about either, the better. But even after lesson
five of
"Teach yourself Sumerian", an experienced linguist will already be
able to
discern the type of language, whether it has an ergative sentence
structure
(Sumerian yes, Tamil no), whether it is flexive or agglutinative or
isolative, etc. etc. So when the professor of Sumerian at my Alma
Mater
dismissed the Dravidian connection, I know his knowledge of Dravidian
doesn't match his knowledge of Sumerian, yet I wouldn't dismiss his
opinion
as entirely uninformed.-By Dr.Loganathan.]
Here we have tried to retrive …¤§ÁâÂý(Sumerian)suruppak neri(code)
into Tamil:
1. [u] ri-a u sud-ra ri-a ( In those distant days, in those far
remote days)

2. gi ri-a gi bad-du ri-a ( In those nights, in those far-away
nights)
3. mu ri-a mu sud-ra ri-a ( In those years, in those far remote
years)
4. u-ba gestu.tuku inim.galam inim.zu-a kalam-ma ti-la-am ( In those
days, the intelligent one, who made the elaborate words, who knew
the (proper) words, and was living in Sumer .
5.Suruppak gestu.tuku inim.galam inim.zu-a kalam-ma ti-la-am (
Suruppak - the inelligent one, who made the elaborate words , who
knew the (proper) words, and was living in Sumer

"cuudu"chudar=the primordial ray.
2.þâ¨Á ÀñΨÁ þâ =irul soozhndha ap pandaiya kawlam.
1. °÷ ±Ã¢Â °÷ ͼ÷ ±Ã¢Â=oor vilangiya ath thol kawlaththil.
3.㧾¡÷ «Ã¢Â ãРͼ÷ «Ã¢Â =moothor arindha am mudhal kawlam.
4.ÝÕÀ¡ìÌ §¸¡û¦¾¡ÌòÐ ±É ÁɸÄõ ±É ÝÅ ¸Çõ Á¾¢ þø ¬õ =ÍÕÀ¡ìÌ
þð¼ §¸¡û
«Åý ÁÉì ¸Äõ ±Ûõ ÍÅ ¸Çõ ¯û þøÄõ.§¸¡û=code laid down by
suruppak with
extraordinary brillianceÁÉì ¸Äõ ±Ûõ ÍÅ ¸Çõ ¯û þøÄõ lived in
sumeria
5.°÷ §¸¡û ¦¾¡ÌòÐ ±É ÁɸÄõ ±É ÝÅ ¸Çõ Á¾¢ þø ¬õ =the
intelligent
one who divised the code lived in sumer.
Gestu can be §¸¡û=«¸Šò=«¸ì§¸¡û ÅÌòÐ
nig.nam kal-kal-en nig-e me-kal-kal ( You appreciate something,
it appreciates you).¿¡õ ¿¢¸ú׸¨Ä ¸üÈ¡ø.«ý ¿¢¸ú§Å ¦Áö ¸¡ðÎõ
Ta.¿¡õ ¿ø ¿¢¸ú׸¨Ä ¸üÈ¡ø.«ý ¿¢¸ú§Å ¦Áö ¸¡ðÎõ
repetition of words like kal-kal,nil-nil as reverberating sounds
either to stress a point or to strech a meaning is even today found
in pinglish(nigerian english)down-down means far down.go-go means go
fast right now.
One must keep in mind that @ the time sumerian tablet were written
there must not have been grammar limitation or that the tablets
followed colloquial slangs.here kal should be interpreted as
kalvi ,gnyan,kal -kal is to stress a point that we should be abreast
with information on our surrounding to know the truth. i think this
interpretation could be accomodated linguistically.
This duplication of words occurs in sanskrit sloka which says
rogawn mochaya mochaya
awyur vardhaya vardhaya
Ta/ͦÁâ«ý:. nikaznam naa-kal jii kukuuyidu.
¿¡õ ¿¢¸ú¨Å ¸ü¸¡Å¢Êý ¯ûÇõ ÌÕ¸¢Îõ
jii might have existed earlier in tamil now avilable in sanskrit.


tamu.moo kan.Gim iGi. Kan.kan ( My son, your eyes should be
brilliant like the sun).
¾õ ãì¸ñ þ¨Á ¸½ø̸=let thy vision throw radiance of the sun
he-su-he-za-a nanna li-bi-in-du-ga za-a-akam bi-in-du-ga
That one has not recited as "Known! Be it Known!" of Nanna , that
one has recited as a "Tis Thine!"
²Í ²ÍÅ ¿ýÉ¡ þÄ¢ À£Â¢ý àì¸, ƒ¡«¸õ À£Â¢ý àì¸ (this could be-§¸Ù
(ûÅ¢)-
§¸Ç¡ ¿ý(ÉÄ¡)È¡ö þÕôÀ¢ýê¸ ¯û «¸õ (þÕ)À¢ýê¸. By questioning
to the
deeper consciousness and acting acccordingly one purifies ones soul.
124 ki-gim dagal-la-za he-zu-am
That you are broad as the earth -- be it known!
¸£ú¹¢õ ¾¸øÄ ƒ¡« ® Ý ¬õ! þì(¸¢)(refer to earth)(kig)þõ¾(imdu-
nimdu=refer to you)«¸ÄÆ §¸é(Ø)¬õ
an-gim mah-a-za he-zu-am
That you are lofty as Heaven-- be it known!
Å¡ý ¹¢õ Á¡‹« ƒ¡ ® Ý ¬õ!(«íÌ þõ Á¸ ¬Æ §¸é(Ø)¬õ!)that this
vast
expanse queried be it known
135. nin-ki-aga-an-na-me-en mir-mir-zu ga-am-du
Oh my lady veloved of An, I have verily recited your fury!
¿¢ý ¸¡í¸ ¬ñ½ Áý Á£÷ Á£÷ƒ¤ ¹¡«õ àì¯=¿¢ý¸¢ «¸ «ýɧÁ ±ýÁ¢÷ Á¢
÷Ù¸ «õÎ
(ê).±ý «ýÉõ §À¡¿Å§Ç ±ý Á¢à Á¢÷é¸(fury) ¬õ ±ýÕ.
123. an-gim mah-a-za he-zu-am
That you are lofty as Heaven-- be it known!
Å¡ý ¹¢õ Á¡‹« ƒ¡ ® Ý ¬õ!(«íÌ þõ Á¸ ¬Æ §¸é(Ø)¬õ!)that this
vast
expanse queried be it known
124 ki-gim dagal-la-za he-zu-am
That you are broad as the earth -- be it known!
¸£ú¹¢õ ¾¸øÄ ƒ¡« ® Ý ¬õ! þì(¸¢)(refer to earth)(kig)þõ¾(imdu-
nimdu=refer to you)«¸ÄÆ §¸é(Ø)¬õ
125. ki-bala-gul-gul-lu-za he-zu-am
That you devastate the rebellious land- be it know !
¸£úÅÄ ¦¸¡ø¦¸¡øÖ ƒ¡« ® Ý ¬õ! (þì(your/its) ÀÄÌ-{ÅøÄÌ}
(strength) ¯ûÌ
¯û(from the innermost) ¯Æ(plough)
Derive your strength from the innermost.
125a kur-ra gu-de-za he-zu-am
That you roar at the land - be it known!
ÌýÈ Ü¢§¼ ƒ¡« ® Ý ¬õ! =ÌüÈ ÜÊÆ(Üʼ)you will bounce back.
135. nin-ki-aga-an-na-me-en mir-mir-zu ga-am-du
Oh my lady veloved of An, I have verily recited your fury!
¿¢ý ¸¡í¸ ¬ñ½ Áý Á£÷ Á£÷ƒ¤ ¹¡«õ àì¯=¿¢ý¸¢ «¸ «ýɧÁ ±ýÁ¢÷ Á¢
÷Ù¸(Á¢
Ãé¸) «õÎ(ê).±ý «ýÉõ §À¡¿Å§Ç ±ý Á¢à Á¢÷é¸(fury) ¬õ ±ýÕ.
24. uLukaL eenliillee aal siiyimma
¯Ù¸û ²ñÄ£ø§Ä(±ýÉ¢ø þ¨Ä) ¬ø º£õÁ («Æ¢¨Á)

25. iin-anna saaGki paartta utu-eekaL
®ÉýÉ¡(«ý¨É¢ý) º¡í¸¢(¦ºö¨¸ À¡÷ò¾ )¯Ð²¸û ¯Ð(¯Â÷ó¾-ãÐÅ÷)
§†¸ø(§¸Ùí¸û)

26. niitaah kaaLka uunuta munsiiyee
¿£¾¿¢ò¾õ) ¸¡û¸(¸¡ø¸û) °Ûò¾(°ÛÕ¸-þÃò¾õ ¯Õ¸-¦Åö¢ø¸¡Â)
Óýº£§Â

27. il iisakkunRa kiishnee edu
þø ®ŠÌýÈ(®Æ-ÌüÈõ)þøÄÃ(house) ÌüÈõ ¸£Š§É ±Î (¸£§Æ ¿£Îõ)¦ÅÇ¢§Â
(society) ¦¾¡¼Õõ.

28. tamu uurunakiinee kuuv mun.iduvee
¾Ó °ÕÉ츢§É(°÷ þÉì(¾¢÷)¦¸É) Ü Óý¢§¼ (ÜÅ¢ Өâ¼)

29. Kootiyum eeNliille emmana sii
§¸¡¾¢Ôõ(ÌÊÔõ) ²ñÄ£ø§Ä(±ýÉ¢ø þ¨Ä) ±õÁÉ º£ {ÁÉ ¬Æ(ò¾¢Öõ)}-
ÌÊ «¨ÁôÀÐ ±ý ÁÉ ¬Æò¾¢Öõ þø¨Ä.

30. Ninmoo iin-anna aataavumun. tamuzi
¿¢ý§Á¡(¿¢ý Óý) ®ÉýÉ¡(«ý¨É¢ý) ¬¾¡×Óý(¬¾(†)Ã(Ó)×õ ¾Óƒ¢
(¯ñÎõ °Æ¢)

Now it is getting proved that that the base of sanskrit is Tamil:
Let us see this by my retrivals:
The word sanskrit should be splitted as sa-krit and read as ha-
thirutha.For all the manipulation of the consonants and creation of
four order including for sa-sa,sha,shah,ha are with the help of ha
and it may be the corruption of "ha-thiruththam " that it became to
be called as sanskrit.Sanskrit is Tamizhin Ha-thiruththam
etymologically it could be
hathiruth-hathrith-sathrith-sanskrith.ºÁ÷ôÀ¡Á¢,¬Å¡†Â¡Á¢=þ¨¾ ¾Á¢Æ¢ø
Á£ðÌõ ¦À¡-ØÐ=¡§Á §º÷§Àý=ºÁ÷ôÀ+¡Á¢,
¡§ÁÅ¡¸(¬Ì¸)¡Á¢+¬Å¡†,±ýÈ¡¸¢ÃÐ.
The first verse in rgkrit tamil retrieved:
«ì¿¢õ ®§¼ ҧḢ¾õ.
¿¢õretained still in kannada(¿¢ý) «¸õ(¯ûÇõ-internal fire) ®§¼
(equivelance)þðÎ(ignite)purohit=À¡÷¸¼õ(vast expanse)
lexically
pawrkadam/parkadam/porkadam/porkitham/porhitham/purhitham/purohitam.
ˆýŠ §¾Åõ ÕòÅ¢ƒõ §†¡¾¡Ãõ ÃòÉ ¾¡¾Áõ
±ýÛ¨¼Â §¾¨Å ¯Â÷Å¢¼õ ,§¸¡÷¾¡Õõ(§¸¡Ã¢ÂÅÕõ)þÃò¾¢É ¾¡ø-¾Á÷.
«ìÉ¢(¿¢ý «¸õ)â÷†¢(¦À¡í¸¢) {â÷}-ÅåÀ¢÷(ÅÕÁ¢ý) Õ„¢À¢÷(¯Õ¸¢-À¢ý)
®¼§Â¡(®Î¨¼Â) ᾨÉ÷ ¯¾(¯ó¾¨É)
…§¾(º¡÷óÐ/§º÷òÐ) Å¡õÉ(Å¡Éõ) ²†Åì(±ØÅ/²üÈ¢Â)-„¾¢(¸¾¢).
---«ìɢɡ(¿¢ý «¸õ) âÁ(þ¨È¨Á)‰ÛÅò(¸ÛÅò/«ÏÌÅÐ), §À¡„õ
(§À¡¸õ/¦ÀÕÌõ)( ²Å(²Å¢)
¾¢§Å¾¢§Å(¾¢¨¸ ¾¢¨¸)(astonishment)(unlimited)
„…õ(¡¸Çõ/¡í¸Ùõ)Å£ÃÅò¾Áõ(¾£Å£÷ÅÇ÷¾õ ¬õ)/(¾£Â¢÷ ÅÇ÷¾¨Á ¬õ).
«ì§É(¿¢ý «¸õ) Âõ(±õ) ˆýÂõ(²üÈõ/±Ã¢+«Ãõ) «òÅÃõ(«òÐÅÃõ-¬üÚ
ÅÃõÒ) Å¢‰Å¾†(Å¢¨ÇŨ¾) ÀââÃ(«)…¢(À¡÷ §À¡üÈ¢)
… þ¾(±ö¾/¯Â÷ó¾) §¾§Å„¤(§¾¨ÅìÌ) ¸îº¾¢(¸üȾ¢/¸üÈÐ).
¿¢ý «¸õ ±õ ²üÈõ(±Ã¢+«Ãõ) «òÐÅÃõ(-¬üÚ ÅÃõÒ) («¾É¡ø)Å¢¨ÇŨ¾
À¡÷ §À¡üÈ¢
±ö¾/¯Â÷ó¾ §¾¨ÅìÌ ¸üȾ¢/¸üÈÐ(¯¸ó¾Ð).
---«ìÉ¢÷(¿¢¨Ã «ìÉ¢) §†¡¾¡(§¸¡÷¾) ¸Å¢ìì(kalvi/¸ü¸)-ÃІ¤(†¥ÐÃ-
Ü÷óÐ/ÜâòÐ/¯îºÃ¢òÐ) …ò‰(ÂòÂì-²üȢ¸) º¢òÃ(º£÷¾/º£Õ¨¼¨Á) ‰ÃÅŠ
(¸ÃÅø)
¾Á†§¾§Å¡(¾õ «¸ò §¾¨Å§Â¡) §¾§ÅÀ¢÷(À¢(È)÷(here it refers to God)
§¾¨Å¡¸ðÎõ).
¿¢¨Ã «ìÉ¢ §¸¡÷¾ kalvi/¸ü¸ †¥ÐÃ-Ü÷óÐ/ÜâòÐ/¯îºÃ¢òÐ ÂòÂì-²üȢ¸
º£÷¾/º£Õ¨¼¨Á-
-¸ÃÅø
¾õ «¸ò §¾¨Å§Â¡ À¢(È)÷(here it refers to God) §¾¨Å¡¸ðÎõ.
Gruha could be a Corruption of Old Tamil Word Koorai Which goes to
the root Kooru(Pyramid is the todays meaning of this representative
structure)Kooru/koorai/kurai/kruhai/gruha.
Rig Veda May be subtle tamil word þ¨ÃìÌ(kadavul) §ÅûÅ¢.it means
whole lot of changes in meaning of the word Rg veda.
Rig/iraigu/iraikku -veda has been connected to the meaning a
bodyofknowledge Now i feel ve+da+veelvi(sacred oblation to god.This
is substantiated by the first verse of rg veda .
«ìÉ¢õ ®¦Ç Ҧᆢ¾õ.I conclude by giving the correct retrieval for
rg veda=þ¨ÃÌ §ÅûÅ¢.
As i said sanskrit branched out of her mother Tamil by exploiting
and interpolating on the ayutha ezhuththu.Creating two intermediary
order of consonents.
If can intelligently remove some of these order from sanskrit words
and replace them with tamil consonents we are looking at the mother
of sanskrit that is Tamil.
Eg:agni-fire
in tamil it can be fit as :
Agani=Aga+ni
ni might be referral to godly attribute sacredity,and Aga-fire
(horrific).We can try to interprete sanskrit sentences by applying
this method to prove it is an offshoot of tamil.
the examples presented are put in tamil characters as follows:
´¼õ-flow,-pronounced as "odam"µð¼õ-run,flow again,but read
as "ottam"
In the first case the consonent '¼' is read as "da" since the same
occurs in the middle of the word so in the second order there can
be
only two order of the consonents evn modern english exemplifies
this
like:
p,b.
t,d.
c,j.
k,g. h=is ha in sanskrit and ayutha ezhuththu in tamil.
most of others are combination consonents like f=p+h,
q=ku=k+u .
w=u+u
x=a+k+s
z=s+h+e+e.
À¡¸õ=part.Ka tranforms to Ga in the middle.
À¡ìÌ=beetle nut.here Gu gets reduced to 'ikku'
Now i will talk about the intermediate orders produced by
sanskrit

Kha=ik+a+ha.
gha=ig+a+ha/ik+ha+a+ha,presuming that ga second order consonent is
produced by combination of ik+1/2ha.

cha=ich+a+ha
jha=ij+a+ha/ich+ha+a+ha

tha=it+a+ha
dha=idh+a+ha/ith+ha+a+ha
fa=ip+a+ha bha=ib+a+ha/ip+ha+a+ha
The uniqueness in Tamil is giving importance to mey ezhuththu and
in
combination with vowels produce consonents
Ith+a=tha
this is not in sanskrit.
So what gets exploited so much so is the "ha"produced by tamil
ayutham.
---One has to remember that second order has no written recognition
in tamil pa becomes ba in any place of the word other than at the
start of the word but cannot be expressed in writting it is a oral
convention.
words starting with consonents will have expressed first order.
r,s,l,zha normally do not start a word except with the help of a
consonent preceding.

"r,s,l,zha normally do not start a word except with the help of a
consonent preceding"
even vowels can precede them.
ya=is formed by=A+i+a
The peculiarity of cha is that at any place other than the first in
a word it lightens to sa and preceding with another half consonent
ich it regains cha status.
Language learners in the formal education pattern are not fed with
good logic resulting in bad pronounciation which we often see.
kha/gha" as "¸·«' and with that eliminate the need for '‹' in the
script?
"¸·«'can be "¸·"and "ig"can be"·ì"."ghan"(musik)can be"¸·¬ý".it
could be "¸·¡ý" .
Like this we transliterate sanskrit text but my idea goes beyond
this.
Since sanskrit is a derived language from tamil i am in the order
of
fixing sanskrit to tamil orgin not to attempt adapting tamil to
sanskrit as i told you that sanskri is a derived language.
I had already told you that we have to eliminate intermediate
consonents from sanskrit words and adopt tamil equivalent to prove
that the world is classical tamil or sumerian tamil.There may be
varients in the process of development cycle of sanskrit.
One thing comes to my mind is that rg veda could be a product of
1st
tamil sangam.
tamil and sankrit are now two school of thoughts emerging from
their
mother sumerian tamil.While formulation of rg veda there might two
school of thoughts one to restrict phonetics to first order
consonents and second to elongate to intermediary order this also
the reason i believe that we can reduce sanskrit to its orginal
tamil form.
May be we are making some progress here that may lead into
understanding better how from the same basic phonology of Sumerian
the phonology of Sanskrit as different from it developed.
The need to induce large volume of words into the vocabulary
could have resulted in thinkers of those days to extrapolate (ha)to
form multitude of permutations in the language and form a new
structural varient from sumerian tamil.
sanskrit and c.tamil should then share same roots for their
ancestors are same that is dravidians and not aryans.
Attempt towards this proposition ahs already started and let us hope
in the near future we will be able to substantiate this view.

[Oldposts]

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Tolkaappiyar/

[Oldposts]

Wow, Sanskirit gain equal status like Thamizh. It is amazing how politics work. Power to the hindis.

[Oldposts]

I would like to Start this series befitting to this group with my
own interpretation of this Classic.
I would like to directly dwelve into the book instead of wasting time
on describing such a great work which already has a place of eminance
in Tamil.
1.The letters A« to Naý form the scheme of alphabet design in Tamil.
2.There are total 30 independent sounds and three dependant sounds.
3.A measure of sound length is equivalent to the wink time of the
eyes.
4.All sounds of a vowel have one measure except long vowels Which
has two measure. Aw,EE,Oo,AeAe,Aai,Oo,Oou.¬,®,µ,°,¶,³,².
5.No sound produce three measure if necessary the same can be done
(This is the Flexibility visualised by Tolkaapiyar which should be
read in relation with the higher orders of consonants derived from
primary orders).
6.There are twelve Vowels.
7.Eighteen consonantswith ýNa at the end.
8.A consonant has 1 and 1/2 measure.
9.Three dependant sounds have 1/2 measureþ,´,·.1/2 E,1/2 O,1/2 Ha.

---«,¬,þ,®,¯,°,±,²,³,´,µ,¶,·.
Dependant sounds are þ,¯,·.
¸,¹,º,»,¼,½,¾,¿,À,Á,Â,Ã,Ä,Å,Æ,Ç,ÈÉ.
akshara /
> ezuttu) Since you had raked up this issue let me explain:
±Ø+òÐ=the meaning of ezhu is arise see ezhuchchi ezhu also means a
state of defining an art of explaining thing,See ezhudhu means to
write to express.Compare this with akshara=A+(k)shara=shara can be a
series ,a row, it is defined as representing Alphabets or syllable.
Aksharawnawm Akawrosmi.Whereas the same when converted into a verb
or an act of expression looses its importance and Likhita/Lekhi
comes to rescue.
Akshara can be retrieved to Tamil as A+chawrndha(Belonging to A
(metaphysical))=or adhanai chawrntha=belonging to that.
While the verb representation is retained in Ezhuththu as ezhududhal
(Kriya).
I hope this would suffice to clarify your doubt.
I would request you to use Murasu Anjal and bear with me.
Yawdhum oorae yawvarum kaelir.

A vowel is always combined after the consonant(1/2measure) to
release it full shape.
ik,iC,it,ith,ip,ir, ì,î,ð,ò,ô,÷are consonant of strong expression.

A vowel is always combined after the consonant(1/2measure) to
> release it full shape.
> ik,iC,it,ith,ip,ir, ì,î,ð,ò,ô,üare consonant of strong expression.
>
> ¹,»,½,¿,Á,É.-sounds of mild nature.
Â,Ã,Ä,Å,Æ,Ç,-sounds of intermediate
nature.Mellinam,vallinam,idaiyinam as they are called.
The evaluation of Vowel-consonant relation in Tolkappiyam is par
excellance which could not be located by me while reading Sanskrit
or Aphabhramsha Grammer.
The categorisation of Vowel-consonant in relation with sound produce
into strong/mild/intermediate orders of sounds shows the depth of
grammar roots in Tamil prior to Tolkappiyam.
Tolkappiyar do not claim himself as originator of grammar in Tamil
in the very early part of the work he states ÜðÊ ±Øоø ±ýÁÉ¡÷
ÒÄÅ÷(thus states the "Bard/poets/learned"[No sound produce three
measure if necessary the same can be done]This could be the primary
discovery towards agglutination in the later stage.The reference to
Bards points to such similar works preexisting.
¯½÷󧾡÷ ¸ñ¼Å¡§È(as visualised by the enlightened in the very
next sentence when he talks of measure of a sound in a syllable.
¦Áö¢ý ÅÆ¢§Â ¯Â¢÷ §¾¡ýÚ ¿¢¨Ä§Â=Beutifully classifying Vowels as
soul and consonant as body and stating that through the body the
soul enlivened which resulted in vowel consonant.
He classifies vowels again as :
«,þ,¯ as pointer.
¬,²,µ as questioner.
«Ç À¢ÈóÐ ¯Â÷¾Öõ
´üÚ þ¨º ¿£¼Öõ ¯Ç
±É ¦Á¡Æ¢À
þ¨º§Â¡Î º¢Å½¢Â
¿ÃõÀ¢ý Á¨ÈÂ
±ýÁÉ¡÷ ÒÄÅ÷.
This is a authoritative text on how Vowels and consonants beyond
this existed in Tamil.Which only means iyar thamizh has the set
framed by Tolkappiyam with isai thamizh having additive sounds of
vowels and consonants.
This should be read in conjunction with
No sound produce three measure if necessary the same can be done.
The flexibility of Tamizh grammar in recognition of sounds and
combination thereof cannot be more precisely expressed than this.

«õ ãÅ¡Úõ(the categorisation of consonants into strong mild and
intermediate) ÅÆí¸¢-þÂø ÁÕí¸¢ý
¦Áö ÁÂíÌ ¯¼ý ¿¢¨Ä
¦¾Ã¢Ôí¸¡¨Ä.
In that categorisation .
ÅÆí¸¢Â þÂø ÁÕí¸¢ý if the original nature of "vowel-consonants" so
changes(I propose marungin as change maru+ngin is other side
maruppu ,mawtru.).
Consonant fades(mey mayangu).
udan nilai theriyun kawlai(¯¼ý ¿¢¨Ä should be pointing to the vowel
adjuncting the consonant forming the new vowel consonant.¦¾Ã¢Ôý¸¡¨Ä
thus exposites.)For the consonant fades in sound vowel explicits
with force to form higher orders.The higher orders can thus be
formed according to Tolkappiyan.
I would like to have Dr.Logas view on this discovery i hope the
conventional meaning assigned to this verse is thrashed.
I thus conclude the first chapter on tolkappiyam with ny own
discovery of how the thirteenth vowel or (ha) increases the order of
consonants to be precise vowel-consonants.
The formation of Ha itself may be a vowel-consonant though i feel it
has neutar quality.
the expression could be reduction in the measure of consonant Ikì in
conjunction with a«.It could be quarter measure of Ik +one measure A
like it occurs for m in (om).
Having laid the sound structure Tolkappiyar went on to discuss
some combinatory method of consonants.Like:
ð,ø,ü,û are followed by ¸,º,À(Vowel consonant).
Of these ø,û can be followed by Â,Å.
Mild consonants are followed by hard consonants.
Of these ý,ñ are also followed by ¸,º,À,Á,Â,Å,».
Â,Ã,Æ are followed by hard consonants and ¹.
Á is followed by Å.
excepting Ã,Æ other consonants can have immediate double occurances.

Lesson definitely refers to a structure framed by Tolkappiyar
when he started with expression of syllable and sound system.
Second he talks about some usages of syllables and occurances.
Third with how sounds emanate.etc and so forth.
¦Áö ÁÂí̾ø is a state of trance where ¦Áö ±ØòÐ fades are gets so
embedded that vowel becomes more explicit and emanates higher orders.
A pertinent question that you have raised that it occurs only in
strong consonants¸,º,¼,¾,À,yes true since this is how sanskrit might
have generated higher orders.In case of mild and intermediate
consonants they are independent sound systems devoid of known orders
but as tolkappiyar states þ¨º ¾Á¢ú may have orders in them too.
Let us now see what Tol has to say about this Letter which i had
been stating as source of higher order consonants.
ÌȢ¾ý ÓýÉ÷ ¬Ô¾ô ÒûÇ¢
¯Â¢§Ã¡Î Ò½÷ó¾ ÅøÄ¡Èý Á¢¨ºò§¾
®È¢Âø ÁÕí¸¢Ûõ þ¨º¨Áò §¾¡ýÚõ
¯ÕÅ¢Ûõ þ¨ºÂ¢Ûõ «Õ¸¢ò §¾¡ýÕõ
¦Á¡Æ¢ ÌÈ¢ôÒ ±øÄ¡õ ±Øò¾¢ý þÂÄ
¬Â¢¾õ «·¸¡ì ¸¡¨Ä¡É.

After the short vowels occurs the Ayutha .
Incombination with such vowels preceding the ayutha the
strong "vowel-consonants"follows.«·Ð.

®È¢Âø(here should be construed as the fusion between vowel that
precedes the ayutham and the "strong vowel-consonant"that
follows,This fusion results in culmination of musical notes.I would
like to say that higher orders are representative of musik and may
be that is the reason Lord Krishna said that he represents Sawman
among vedas) ÁÕí¸¢Ûõ þ¨º¨Áò §¾¡ýÚõ.

¯ÕÅ¢Ûõ þ¨ºÂ¢Ûõ(in structure and musical notes) «Õ¸¢ò §¾¡ýÕõ(it
looks alike)

¦Á¡Æ¢ ÌÈ¢ôÒ ±øÄ¡õ ±Øò¾¢ý þÂÄ¡(Sound which cannot be expressed in
writing)
¬Â¢¾õ(ayutham) «·¸¡ì(represented by this sound akhkawk) ¸¡¨Ä¡É
(exposited)

On Vadachchol:
þ*Âü¦º¡ø ¾¢Ã¢¦º¡ø ¾¢¨ºî¦º¡ø ż¦º¡ø ±ýÚ
«¨Éò§¾ ¦ºöÔû ®ð¼î ¦º¡ø§Ä. 1
«ÅüÚû,þ*Âü¦º¡ø¾¡§Á
¦ºó¾Á¢ú ¿¢ÄòÐ ÅÆ즸¡Î º¢Å½¢
¾õ ¦À¡Õû ÅÆ¡¨Á *¨ºìÌõ ¦º¡ø§Ä. 2
´Õ ¦À¡Õû ÌÈ¢ò¾ §ÅÚ ¦º¡ø ¬¸¢Ôõ
§ÅÚ ¦À¡Õû ÌÈ¢ò¾ ´Õ ¦º¡ø ¬¸¢Ôõ
*þÕ À¡üÚ ±ýÀ ¾¢Ã¢¦º¡ø ¸¢ÇÅ¢. 3
¦ºó¾Á¢ú §º÷ó¾ ÀýÉ¢Õ ¿¢ÄòÐõ
¾õ ÌÈ¢ôÀ¢É§Å ¾¢¨ºî¦º¡ø ¸¢ÇÅ¢. 4
*****************************************
"ż¦º¡ø ¸¢ÇÅ¢ ż ±ØòÐ ´Ã£*
±Øò¦¾¡Î Ò½÷ó¾ ¦º¡ø ¬Ìõ§Á. 5"
"Flexed words are those with higher order Vowel-consonants and the
same when taken to Tamil have to be adapted to the tamil phonetic
orders or retrieved"

**********************************************
º¢¨¾ó¾É ÅâÛõ þ*¨Âó¾É Ũá÷. 6
Here one should see in aphorism no.6. above were a words structural
deformity is addressed due to borrowings and adaptations.
On vadachol which i had told that it should be construed as
vadaintha chol a word that is flexed with phonetic orders.
While Tol classifies words asþ*Âü¦º¡ø, ¾¢Ã¢¦º¡ø, ¾¢¨ºî¦º¡ø,
ż¦º¡ø.iyarchol,thirichchol,thisaichchol,vadachcho l,The
interpretation for the word vada has yet remained Northern which
indicates primarily Sanskrit while it may be so I do not find
reality in that meaning since thisaichchol has already been taken to
mean words of twelve different regions if Tolkaappiyar wanted to
indicate directions he would a placed a suitable word.Vada hence
should be construed as vadaintha(Flexed)Indicating the vowel-
consonants orders available in sanskrit and other such languages.
"Flexed words are those with higher order Vowel-consonants and the
same when taken to Tamil have to be adapted to the tamil phonetic
orders or retrieved"



¯Ã¢î¦º¡ø ¸¢ÇÅ¢ ŢâìÌõ ¸¡¨Ä
þ*¨ºÂ¢Ûõ ÌÈ¢ôÀ¢Ûõ ÀñÀ¢Ûõ §¾¡ýÈ¢
¦ÀÂâÛõ Å¢¨É¢Ûõ ¦Áö ¾ÎÁ¡È¢
´Õ ¦º¡ø ÀÄ ¦À¡ÕðÌ ¯Ã¢¨Á §¾¡ýÈ¢Ûõ
ÀÄ ¦º¡ø ´Õ ¦À¡ÕðÌ ¯Ã¢¨Á §¾¡ýÈ¢Ûõ
À¢ġ¾Åü¨Èô À¢ýȨŠº¡÷ò¾¢
¾õ¾õ ÁÃÀ¢ý ¦ºýÚ ¿¢¨Ä ÁÕí¸¢ý
±î ¦º¡ø ¬Â¢Ûõ ¦À¡Õû §ÅÚ ¸¢Çò¾ø.
Again urichchol are those words which when exposites itself by
placement its orgin has to be traced WRT Sound,attributes and
marks.These are those words that can also stand alone and display
meanings.These words have to be clearly studied independantly and
WRT context it is in.These can be foriegn words adaptations as
well.


¯Ã¢î¦º¡ø:
Rig Veda May be subtle tamil word
þ¨ÃìÌ(iraiku) §ÅûÅ¢(veelvi).
it means whole lot of changes in meaning
of the word rg veda Rig/iraigu/iraikku -veda has been
connected to the meaning a body ofknowledge Now i feel ve+da=veelvi
(This is the Tamil word sacrificial fire).There are consonent
transformation in this form that is noticed in Sanskrit when it
became a separate stream .(sacred
oblation to god.
This is substantiated by the first verse
of rg
veda .
«ìÉ¢õ ®¦Ç Ҧᆢ¾õ
i conclude by giving the correct retrieval
for rg veda=þ¨ÃÌ iraiku §ÅûÅ¢ veelvi.
Ru+cha identified as mantra of rg veda is
ru=irai/rai/ri/ru.
cha=chol
iraichol=chol is word= irai refers to god.
The first verse in rgkrit tamil retrieved:
«ì¿¢õ ®§¼ ҧḢ¾õ.I glorify Agni, the high priest of the sacrifice,
the divine
¿¢õ(nim)retained still in kannada(¿¢ý) «¸õ(¯ûÇõ(ullam)-internal
fire)
> > ®§¼ ilae(idae)
> > > > > (equivelance)þðÎ(ittu)like(idli-idduli)(ignite)
purohit=À¡÷¸¼õ(pawrkadam)/purohitam(vast expanse)
> > > > >
lexicallypawrkadam/parkadam/porkadam/porkitham/porhitham/purhitham/pu
rohitam

[Oldposts]

¯ó¾¢ Ӿġ ÓóÐÅÇ¢ §¾¡ýÈ¢òThe sounds are emanating from the naval
with air stream getting released through eight parts.
¾¨Ä¢Ûõ Á¢¼üÈ¢Ûõ ¦¿ïºƒ¢Ûõ ¿¢¨Ä- þô,
ÀøÖõ þ¾Øõ ¿¡×õ ãìÌõ
«ññÓõ ¯ÇÀ¼ ±ñÓ¨È ¿¢¨Ä¡ý
¯ÕôÒüÚ «¨Á ¦¿È¢ôÀ¼ ¿¡Ê(As the sound get structured according to
syntax laid.
±øÄ¡ ±ØòÐõ ¦º¡øÖõ ¸¡¨ÄôThe state of all syllables and words
À¢ÈôÀ¢ý ¬ì¸õ §ÅÚ§ÅÚ þÂÄ by impact of production and its effect
express and act differently
¾¢ÈôÀ¼ò ¦¾Ã¢Ôõ ¸¡ðº¢Â¡É Which shall be seen and experienced.

[Oldposts]

Intersting.

[Oldposts]

//I do not find
reality in that meaning since thisaichchol has already been taken to
mean words of twelve different regions if Tolkaappiyar wanted to
indicate directions he would a placed a suitable word.Vada hence
should be construed as vadaintha(Flexed)Indicating the vowel-
consonants orders available in sanskrit and other such languages.
"Flexed words are those with higher order Vowel-consonants and the
same when taken to Tamil have to be adapted to the tamil phonetic
orders or retrieved" //

Very good analysis!!

[Oldposts]

your site details tell me
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[adsort]

nice find.

[ProudAryan]

This is in reply to Ashok.

Aryans are the most advanced people of all times and are spread out in every part of the world and are represented by people from the most advanced nations.

[Offesive text deleted]

Bottomline: It's better to be born an Aryan than a Dravidian.