THE ARIYAN QUESTION

[dsath]

I am a bit sceptical about that one. I meant the south Indian connection with South America.
This page talks about the helmet
http://www.zealand.org.nz/history.htm

[pradheep]

It is likely that M173 arose initially in Central Asia, and that M173-carrying subpopulations migrated westward into Europe soon thereafter. The extremely high frequency of this haplotype in Western Europe is probably the result of drift, consistent with an inferred population bottleneck during the Last Glacial Maximum (4, 17).

The American descendant of M45, defined by the marker M3, may be as little as 2,000 years old (10); this finding, as well as the fact that it is not found in Central Asia or Siberia, suggests that the expansion of this haplotype occurred entirely within the Americas. An assessment of the upper limit to the date of entry of humans into the Americas therefore awaits the identification of further markers on the M45 lineage that are ancestral to M3 and are found in both Central Asia and America. What seems clear, though, is that an ancient M45-containing population living in Central Asia was the source of much modern European and Native American Y-chromosome diversity.

http://www.pubmedcentral.gov/article...medid=11526236

[dsath]

http://www.pubmedcentral.gov/article...medid=11526236

A good link.

[devapriya]

Friends,

Many theories about mythological Atalantis are in Web, and none satisies Science.

No major Land mass is found below- Indian Ocean to Pacific.

Sangam Lit. or any other Tamil Lit has nothing about Kumarikandam even indirectly, Unless you Misinterpret.

Dev

[mahadevan]

Oh Maaeeeeeen look who is talking about science, for kumari kandam he needs objective scientific evidence, while for sanskrit crap the earliest of which is around 200 AD he does not need nothing. Solomon do you have multiple personality problem ? Even a hard core fanatic (if he is not a moron) can some times see the wrong in his self beliefs, you do not do that, so am I correct in guessing about your multiple personality problem ?

[mahadevan]

Somebody please tell why is this difference in the cultural traits of north and south indians

i) Wheat is the staple food in north like that of europe while rice is the staple food in south

ii)the concept of cheese is non existant in south even today, in the north cheese (panneer or its derivatives) is a part of the regular diet just like the europeans

iii)Baking is totally absent in the southern cuisine, it is the most widely used in the northeren cuisine (Naan, Roti) like the bread of the europeans.

iv) Northern musical instruments are strikingly different from their Southern counterparts. For instance the southern percussion instrument miruthangam has the leather on the sides while the northern table has the leather on the top more like the western drums.

v)Northen languages are spoken more from inside the mouth and less tongue twisting, more like the european languages, whereas the southern languages emphasize more on the tongue twisting.

vi)Another noticible difference is the speed with which the language is spoken, north Indian language speakers talk relatively very slowly like the europeans, while the southerners talk very fast more like the africans. Just listen to a northerener and southerner talking in English.

vii)Among the non veg people, fish is very common in southern diet while it is very much not a part of northern plate, with the exception of Bengalis.

hey the list can on and on

[happyindian]

Mahadevan,

i) Wheat is the staple food in north like that of europe while rice is the staple food in south

Its obvious. Ask any farmer to grow rice in kashmir and wheat in kerala he'll think u r an alien from mars. Climate, soil type, water availability, wind direction & the rains they bring....there r many reasons.

ii)the concept of cheese is non existant in south even today, in the north cheese (panneer or its derivatives) is a part of the regular diet just like the europeans

The whites christened paneer as "cottage cheese" (dunno why?? coz its a milk derivative?) Am wondering then perhaps Khoya / Khova shd also be called one form of cheese (what's khoya called in english anyone?). Milk derivatives are more common in the north coz fewer types of vegetables grow there due to harsh winters.

iii)Baking is totally absent in the southern cuisine, it is the most widely used in the northeren cuisine (Naan, Roti) like the bread of the europeans.

Chilly gusty winds put out fires in winters. In villages you can still see women digging a pit and putting fire into it to prevent it from going out for cooking / baking. Such hearths ensured food in winter. Necessity is the mother of invention. It isn't necessary to find a diff way of cooking in the south.

iv) Northern musical instruments are strikingly different from their Southern counterparts. For instance the southern percussion instrument miruthangam has the leather on the sides while the northern table has the leather on the top more like the western drums.

Waaa Look at it this way: both use leather - hw does it matter if its on the side or on top?

v. Northen languages are spoken more from inside the mouth and less tongue twisting, more like the european languages, whereas the southern languages emphasize more on the tongue twisting.

Language development depends mainly on neuro-cognitive function. Tongue twisting may not be necessary to get the message across. Syllables and accent in Hindi (& allied grps like Punjabi, Gujrati, Bengali, Bhojpuri, etc) is rather diff from common european languages like english or spanish. I don't exactly understand "inside of the mouth" -- maybe there are more number of sounds in northern derivatives due to presence of syllables generally absent in Tamil, so when these syllables are spoken without the tongue touching the teeth they sound like they come from within (like stress syllables Kha, Gha, Fa, Ksha, Bha, high sounding Na that sounds like aNa with the tongue folding backwards, etc, which are not there in Tamil). Passing note: I sometimes feel most northerners perhaps devote less time to language development and channelize their energies else-where.

vi)Another noticible difference is the speed with which the language is spoken, north Indian language speakers talk relatively very slowly like the europeans, while the southerners talk very fast more like the africans. Just listen to a northerener and southerner talking in English.

Do ppl bcome diff if they speak fast or slow?

vii)Among the non veg people, fish is very common in southern diet while it is very much not a part of northern plate, with the exception of Bengalis.

N.India is either plains or mountaineous not costal. Coast is only in Gujrat and bengal. So ppl eat fish there (though not much in Gujrat due to strong advocacy of vegetarianism). Perhaps you shd travel those places b4 coming to conclusions. Note: A Bengali friend felt insulted being called "North Indian" (the Bengali spirit is too strong to be clubbed with any other identity) and a good Gujrati friend felt funny being 'classified' as one. These ppl apparently like to be called West Indiands and East Indians. Sigh! .

hey the list can on and on

What else? If you lived in the north or if a present-day northener lived in the south, for both of you, your ways wud change. You wud end up eating high-calorie baked food to withstand the cold. Am told marwadis in the south eat more rice and vegetables than their northern counterparts to prevent constipation due to moisture loss in humid climes.

[dsath]

Consider the following story,
Some 1000 years back some foreigners lets say from country X with superior technology came to Europe . They saw that the Europeans were divided into groups like German, English, French,Spanish and so on. They also noticed that they were fighting with each other a lot. Since the X had advanced technology decided to exploit the situation and by sheer cunning took over all of Europe. Now came the problem, X found it hard to rule over a huge territory. They ruled over Europe as one country, simultaneously increased the rift between the states by exploiting their existing enmity. The X found it hard to learn all the European languages and hence promoted their language XL. The Spanish did not want to learn German and the French sure did not want to learn English. Everyone accepted that using XL as a mean of common language was better, remember the European thought that X were much superior to them.
Finally the Europeans decided enough was enough and fought back, under a single umbrella of Europe. The fact that they were different countries was long forgotten. They did succeed in the end and were granted self rule by X as 2 different countries one Europe and the other England. The reason being that rest of Europe is Catholic while England is Protestant.
How will Europe be after independence? They are all speaking language X and debating if Greek or Latin is older and if Greek is derived form Latin or vice versa. They are trying hard to erase the recent past of occupation by resorting to how rich European culture was before X came.
Isn’t this story relevant to what we are experiencing now in India.
Bengalis and Punjabis are as different as Polish and Spanish. The common thread is that they are both Hindus in the former case and Catholic in the latter.

I think we should appreciate our differences and look at the better aspects in each other cultures.

[indian224080]

Hinduism and Sanskrit are the entities that have kept us together.

[bis_mala]

Hinduism and Sanskrit are the entities that have kept us together.

It's Hindi that has kept the political entity known as India together.
Not Sanskrit.