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Thread: About ICSE Syllabus in India...

  1. #61
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    as thiru said-
    People in India have to realize that.... They have to make the kids realize that there is a future in everything.. The problem in India is that there is a such a gap in salary between the professionals(doctors, s/w people, Chartered accounts) and the non-professionals (clerks, officers) that people tend to enforce that the only way to make money is to be a professional.
    I agree that parents should encourage their kids to do anything they want to.
    but The gap in salary is for a reason-
    In india doctors put in minimum of 7 years of hardwork including the 11th and 12th where they study like crazy to do their best for the medical entrance ,
    engineers put in minimum of 6 years of hardwork including 11th and 12 again and struggle thro'out to outperform others..
    Chartered accountants too put in minimum of 6 years of hardwork..and i heard from one of my friend that preparing for chartered accountant exams is not a joke at all...

    compared to clerks and officers...
    in case of commerce and arts background- not as much hardwork in 11th and 12th - they have a bindaas life compared to science students..and then they get into a 3 year degree and again not much of a hardwork and then become a clerk or an officer if he has a masters degree which again compered to the professionals hardwork is nothing.......In which case i dont see any reason why there should not be a gap in between a clerks salary and other professionals salary mentioned above....

    The more hard work and efffort u put in the higher ur salary..

    One thing always holds good in any big things is LUCK...which if one does not have the most intelligent person can end up being a clerk..

    I really believe that the gap in salary in india has its justification.

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  3. #62
    Senior Member Senior Hubber Thiru's Avatar
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    well napoli,
    the gap might be justified but the way in which the gap is created is certainly not justified... if you want to be a doctor, why should you score 90-95% in maths and physics... If I want to be a computer science engineer, why should I score 90% in chemistry which by the way has nothing to do with my future... why cant a guy be an absolute genius in biology and be very poor in physics? doesnt he deserve a chance.... Our educational system is so much theoretical that the person who can memorize 200 pages of print can end up as a doctor or an engineer... Its the marks and grades that counts and not the knowledge or talent...

  4. #63
    Senior Member Senior Hubber lordstanher's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by hehehewalrus
    No I didnt hint that you went overboard. I was just taking an insurance helmet for myself so that no one accuses me of straying from the topic
    Ohh.....so I daresay we were suspecting each other?!

    Quote Originally Posted by hehehewalrus
    i dont know about other states, but in TN parents and educators follow the safety-first approach which is to seek out an admission into a professional course.
    Same thing here in AP as well.......the irony is tat even I'd taken up Maths/Phy/Chem. in Inter (originally having aimed to study B.Arch!)......and in our college we had to undergo coaching for a popular entrance exam here called EAMCET (Engg./Agri/Med. common entrance test)......u might've heard of it?
    And sum Jr. colls. give mandatory IIT coaching as well......
    So it was like 8 and 1/2 hrs of college for us evryday plus an EAMCET mock test every Sunday morning.....!
    Well, ftly or unftly maths hap'd to be my bugbear, which is y I cudn't get a good enuff rank in EAMCET finally.......so gave up on this route & following a few yrs of taking roads where I kept getting lost, I finally decided to take one I knew, even tho it was less travelled by!

    Quote Originally Posted by hehehewalrus
    As you may be aware of the Landmark decision of the TN CM to do away with the Entrance Exam in Tamil Nadu - the people most affected are the 50 crore worth "teaching shops" which run rigourous crash courses for the entrance tests.
    I daresay tats a wise decision?? Btw, do u mean ent. exams inc. TNCET (heard abt it from a friend once....)??

    Quote Originally Posted by hehehewalrus
    [In AP too, there are these IIT prep trainers like Narayana Institute which are into this industry. Atleast they are much much better than their TN counterparts ].
    Um....I was aware tat Narayana gave prep. for EAMCET.......not sure if it gives for IIT as well.......in Hyd. however, there r 2 competing institutes exclusively for IIT prep. considered to be the best there- Ramaiah's and Krishnamurthy study centre.......
    As for them being better, depends on how u define 'better'?

    Quote Originally Posted by hehehewalrus
    The other thing is that, the responsibility of teaching is solely left to the educators, parents absolve themselves of all responsibilities and no one looks at the home as a stage for learning.
    Very true again.......parents only know when to complain tat their kids ren't studying at home at all during the parents' meet......'known it from my own experience!
    Little do they realise: "parents r our first teachers"......
    In fact I even came across this fitting quote from a site:

    "Young people do not learn only in school. Their surroundings and the times in which they live have as much, if not more, influence on them than teachers!"

    Quote Originally Posted by hehehewalrus
    There was a phase during my time that it was 'uncool' to be seen shopping/outing around with one's parents, dont know if that idea still holds today!
    I was dimly aware of it existing during my schooldays as well.......when I was in 7th, I rem. my classmates commenting in awe abt spotting me once going shopping w/ my mother!

  5. #64
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    Our educational system is so much theoretical that the person who can memorize 200 pages of print can end up as a doctor or an engineer... Its the marks and grades that counts and not the knowledge or talent...
    I understand that our educational system is full of flaws.
    But as u say that just by memorising 200 pages a person cannot cannot become a doctor or engineer...may be in his whole career he might have memorised 10%-15% of his studies..memorising may help in 11th and 12th to get marks but not in professional degree courses where questions are based on practicality which comes from real knowledge and concepts.

    there is a saying if u are aware of-
    "College is a place where diamonds are dimmed and pebbles are polished"
    I agree completely with that...

  6. #65
    Senior Member Senior Hubber Thiru's Avatar
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    True... but the damage had already been done..... the problem is the fact that the guy who memorizes will still walk out with a professional degree (may be not as the topper) whereas the other guy has to choose a different profession altogether....

  7. #66
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    Regarding the points in Thiru vs Napolims debate, I do not think it is feasible in our system for a person to be strong in Subject X, weak in Subject Y and still pursue Subject X in depth - Our educational system does not have enough infrastructure or facilities to have large number of courses like American Universities. Few courses, large candidates - hence Elimination system is a necessary evil to determine the selection of candidates. If we change the system to accomodate weak areas of everyone, then really no one can be eliminated.

    Secondly, while there are lot of areas of improvements, I will not fail to neglect the positive aspects of the system. For instance, the TN method of placing emphasis on mugging and reproduction has been bashed by everyone - I still appreciate some aspects of the system. Our mother tongue is not English but still throughout our education, the medium of instruction is English. There are so many who may grasp the subject in their minds but their power of expression is poor. They will not be able to transmit their thoughts effectively using their own words. Even though I studied 14 years in an English-emphasising school, I lacked fluency and power of expression in English till the time I joined the workforce - it was only after regular usage that I was able to improve in this area.

    I know sufficient number of people from moderately educated backgrounds(both parents at most High school only) who did masters in top universities abroad and transformed their family situation. All these people started as "Muggus" writing answers to questions 5 to 10 times in the beginning, then gradually learnt proper methods of study. I dont think CBSE would allow that especially if your ability to convey ideas in own words is restricted. So there are definitely some postives in the "Muggu" system.

    And abt the demerits and lifestyles of people working in BPOs, there are many many youngsters from poor backgrounds who are able to support their families with earnings of 5K or 6K per month. Call Centers are not just for posh spending/loose living kids(that will honestly be less than 20% I dare to say). Leave the negative aspects aside, call centers have given livelihood to many hopeless youth.

    About parents pushing their children and driving them to wrong goals, I will share a true experience. In school, I had opted for foreign Lang in my Language elective, since after initial investment, it was a high scoring option and demanded little study - this helped me to concentrate on my more important science subjects. While I was finishing school, my mother's friend sought advice for her daughter on the Language elective. Despite my opinions, my mother convinced her to pick up tamil, stating that her own son learnt zero tamil in his school. Years passed by and when the girl finished school, she missed an engineering seat in a good college by a whisker - I am definitely sure she would have made it if she had decided smartly and practically instead of using sentiments !!

    NOTE: There are good and bad in any system, do not waste time fighting or resisting any system. Compromises have to take place some time or the other. (An example is that of recent laws banning bar girls in Chennai/Mumbai restaurants - they banned the profession and within one week 80% of the bar girls were about to take to prostitution as the only source of income for their families in small cities) IF THERE IS SOMETHING GOOD THE SYSTEM LACKED, TAKE PERSONAL INITIATIVE LATER ON AND PRACTISE IT BY YOUR OWN EFFORT INSTEAD OF EXPECTING A COMPLETE OVERHAUL OF THE SYSTEM.

  8. #67
    Senior Member Senior Hubber Thiru's Avatar
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    what about the system where you can pay x lakhs and get a professional degree? Is that system healthy???

    There was a school near my house and my friend who happened to be the correspondent's son also studied in that school.. We all know that the guy knew nothing...he cant even a full sentence of english.. During our 12th standard exam for the first two exams, this guy was given a separate room (can you believe this?? )... a few guys who were jealous of this reported this to DPI and the flying squad (which is supposed to catch people redhanded) came to the school and this guy was allowed to write the remaining exams under the watchful eyes of the flying squad... Everyone expected this guy to fail in those subjects but voila he scored close to 1100 marks in the exam... He ended up joining Annamalai university paying X lakhs because even with his marks he cannot rig a public entrance examination and get into the government colleges.. I remember a neighbour of mine paying 12 lakhs(back in 1991) to join annamalai university and he paid another 15 lakhs to do his Masters in manipal..

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