"Nayakan" among "Time" mag's 100 best

[njv]

Balaji,
I didn't attribute the loss of appeal factor to Mani...it's just a statement about the songs of that specific movie. Though trendy, they lost some of their appeal over time.

OTOH, I still love most songs of agni* the same way when they stormed TN...I can listen to ninnukkOri / poongAvanam / vA vA anbE anbE / thoongAdha vizhigaL reNdu on repeat mode for hours on my player even now The same goes with rAkkammA kaiyaththattu or nenjinilE, nenjinilE / kAdhal sadugudu...

Maddy, you said 'ARR is the pioneer of digital music and he was the one who made stereophonic listening a delight'...I agree partly with your observation, i.e. in the Indian context...however, his basic `composition style' for great songs somewhat follows the grammar of NK and poongAtRu, IMO...

Athu yenna OTOH, NK, IMO ... konja acronyma expand pannungalenpa. OKI.

[njv]

7)Kannathil Muthamaittal-One of his very best,I&My wife saw the film at Urvashi(night show,full house)&couldn't control the tears.IR would have elevated the movie to even more greater heights.Still can't believe ARR got a national award for that.

Cinefan,

I dont know how the awards are determined. If it is based only on the songs, then KM has every reason to get an award. "Oru Deivam Thantha Poove" is worth more than an award. To me this song and the song from WOHE are truly breath-taking songs of ARR.

[nkv]

Why MR is inferior to Mahendran is,

Mahendran's movies, at any point of time, will not sound vulgur. Be it Nenjathai Killathey or Johny or Uthirippookkal or Mullum Malarum...the craftsmenship of a director at its best. And all the above movies were commercial success, without any hip-swinging numbers (probably, Aasayakaathula Thoothu Vittu is the only one in that category).

But many Manirathanam movies (Agninatchathiram & Geethanjali the best examples) are having a fair amount of Vulgur scenes which dequalifies them for being watched along with family. Even movies which had good storylines, had these kind of numbers - totally unwanted (September Matham, Arabikkadaloram, Nila Athu Vanathu Mele, etc etc)

Manirathnam is a good Technician - We can see the technical perfection in each and every aspect of the movie - be it music, camera or whatever. But to become an exceptional director, he has to travel a lot more..

It explains why ManiRathnam has still not got a National Award either for best director or the Movie. Kamal bagged one for Nayakan, ARR for Roja & Kannathil, but not Mani..

Coming to Songs of Mounaragam and Nenjathai Killathey, i would rate Nenjathai Killathey as better coz it was a trend setter. Mounaragam is also equally good, but the freshness is lost somewhere, may be because of the repeated appearances in the channels..

Each time when you hear 'Uravenum Puthiya Vaanil' and 'Eh Thendraley..' you can discover a new instrument in the orchestra.. As somebody told, if the technology was great those days, these songs would have gone somewhere..

Strictly speaking on the quality of the music alone, such a quality music has never re-appeared in Tamil, not even from Ilayaraja, barring some occasional gems from Vidyasagar.

[rajdes]

Further DIGRESSIONon the already Digressed thread
maddy, cut the crap, man. Dont put words in my mouth.
Manisha pathi comment adicha , you will assume the person is a rambha-fan?

BTW, I didnt even remember names like Rambha, Kanaka etc. neenga sonnadhukkappuram dhaan appadi ellam heroine irundhaanga-nu vague-aa gnabagam varudhu. So, it seems like they made a greater impact with you

END DIGRESSION
END DISCUSSION ON HEROINES (from my side atleast)

[rajdes]

Further DIGRESSIONon the already Digressed thread
maddy, cut the crap, man. Dont put words in my mouth.
Manisha pathi comment adicha , you will assume the person is a rambha-fan?

BTW, I didnt even remember names like Rambha, Kanaka etc. neenga sonnadhukkappuram dhaan appadi ellam heroine irundhaanga-nu vague-aa gnabagam varudhu. So, it seems like they made a greater impact with you

END DIGRESSION
END DISCUSSION ON HEROINES (from my side atleast)

[Shankar]

i was the one who called mahendran a 4-film wonder.....and i stand by it.....prove me wrong by giving more movies that did well.....FYI even johnny was a flop so he is no more than a 3-film wonder......whereas MR is a legend with more than 20 yrs in the industry, most respected dir from south, countless NAs, more than 70% success rate, his movie featuring in top 100 movies of all time (global), broke the UK/US markets with Dil Se and many more achievements buddies......u guys have any point to make on mahendran's side???? u guys like mahendran- gr8 i respect it but if u try to put down MR then it is a bad thing......

shankar, y do u always think lesser recognised ppl. r more classy???u used the same arguement for IR-ARR thread , nuthin succeeds like success.....and to the arguement that Bombay was a bad movie, i just cannot accept it.....ask any mumbaiite, he'll tell u it is agud film cos they know wat riots mean.....we have no idea sitting comfortably in TN........

and finally, i love MR-IR combo more than MR-ARR combo, it is a fact.......naradha, take some rest buddy....

Maddy,
You and I use totally different scales to measure the greatness of a person !! As you have admitted yourself, you go ONLY by the commercial success of the person....I go by - how much impact the person had on ME, the individual...I don't give a damn what some unknown bunch of people think of him....That's the reason, why I rate a relatively Unknown MD called Sharath (ever heard of him ?...I'm sure you haven't, bcos he's not successful commercially, though many people with good taste have loved his music) a very good composer !

its not that I am saying lesser recognized ppl are classy...I am complaining that lesser talents are more popular and many people are worshipping them...I am lamenting about the fact of mediocrity ruling the scene !! (I'm happy for kamal, Raja, arr and PC sreeram bocs they are good and they are popular...Not everyone is lucky in that sense)

your arguments like "the most respected director from south", "breaking records in UK/US" etc don't mean anything to me....Anumalik is more popular than Raja in UK & US ? What does it imply ???? I don't give a damn what those people think about Raja...and I know what kind of taste those guys (the majority of them) have !!

Bombay was INDEED a bad movie....the cliched hindu-muslim love theme (beaten to death by ppl like BR), inflicting wound (sux big time), and trying to preach a MOB !!!!!! What a lousy end to a movie...Man, the person preaching is NOT Gandhi to keep people spellbound....some vague unknown entity is trying to stop the riots...and everyone drops their weopons it seems...yArum ingE kAdhula poo suthiNdu alayavillai !!!

People like mahendran, (the first few films) of R C Sakthi, rudrayya were never recognized....We need more people like Adoor Gopalkrishnan, Girish Kasaravalli, Rituparno ghosh & Bharathan and not these half baked self-proclaimed-intellects like MR, SLB and Karan Johars.

[nkv]

Maddy,

The most respected Director from the south is not Manirathnam, its Adoor Gopalakrishnan, For Your Information.

The recent Dadasaheb Phalke Award explains it.

It was these directors like Adoor, Girish etc who made Indian Movies heard in the International Level. Manirathnam movies may have broke collection records in US/UK, but they are watched by Indians only..

Its common with Indians to project mediocority as glory..
Thats why Indian Classical Elements are less popular. We rate commercial directors, Musicians and dancers as GREAT!!
Its sheer injustice done towards the true legends..

BOMBAY was a commercial masala, taken JUST with the intention of making money out of a controversial matter. There is not even a single element of CLASS in that movie.
All Mumabites may term it as great, because they have not got an oppurtunity yet to watch class movies.

In short Manirathnam is a great commercial Director.
But nver a great director. He can be termed as the 'Subhash Ghai' of the south. Nothing More.

[mr_karthik]

Dear all.

See the effect of the discussions. Before I posted my comment about some weak points of Nayagan, this thread was lying bottum of the forum with few cooments (less than 40). Now after my posting only you are all "veeru kondu ezhundhu" started to discuss deeply, not only about Nayagan but spreaded in various wings and number of comments crossed a century (106 till now)

Apart from Nayagan, there are deep analysis about Mouna RAgam, Nenjathai kiLLAthE, UthiripookaL, Bombay and somany movies of Manirathnam and Mahendran. I am happy to see all comments are healthy and valuable (except very few).

So, please dont want to sit in an Assembly where there is no opposition party. Discussions in various views only will bring several facts out. Otherwise there will be nothing, except "jalra" sound.

[S.Balaji]

As Karthik rightly pointed out, both MR and Mahendran are great and creative directors.... Lets give the benefit of time factor to Mahendran and we all will realise that Mahendran was far ahead of times during his days.... A very innovative director.... Brought charm and refreshness to Tamil film industry.....
Nenjathai killadhey itself will speak volumes about his talent greatness..
Its sad that he could not make more movies .... we are the losers...

[Jacky]

What's so great about Mullum Maralum? It has sibling love painted all over it. Had we not had flicks like Pasamalar before? Take Anjali, it's an unexplored theme in Tamil Cinema – about the life of a special child or Kannathil Muthamital where a child yearns to see her biological mother. Has Mahendran done anything unique like that with path breaking scripts? Again Johny, double action, one guy is innocent and other is a rogue. Had we not had MGR movies like that before? In terms of innovative scripts Mahendran definitely loses to Maniratnam.