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Oldposts
30th January 2005, 02:05 PM
Topic started by Adithya (@ thaicache.ksc.net.th) on Wed Mar 13 12:11:12 .


This is a very interesting article which examines about the possibility of the survival of the Tamil language in the next century

If you cannot read this, please download anyone of the TSCII font from
http://www.tamil.net/tscii/tools.html (http://www.tamil.net/tscii/tools.html
)


[tscii:5b8d316096]
Ȣ ȡ Ȣ
. ɡ
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Ǣ¡ 츢. â„Š
šǢ , Ǣ
θȡ. ɡ
š ؾš â¡.
Ţ ȡ, Ƹ
. ɨ째.

ĸ 6000 Ƣ . ɡ
ո 22- ȡ ȡ
80 ţ Ƣ 측 
Ũ Š ȢŢ.

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Ƣ Ȣ Ƣ ȡ
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Ȣ и ׸.

‰ Ȣâ

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š쨸¡Ǣ Ƣ Ƣ¡
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ɡ վ ¢츢.
żƢ , , ɼ, ¡
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š 츢ȡ.
, Ģ Ȣ
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úġ, ɢ¢
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ż ţ о
째 Ţ, ż ġ . ʧ
, ż ?
?

Ȣ
ú
ź
ɸ
17 â 2002

[/tscii:5b8d316096]

Oldposts
30th January 2005, 02:05 PM
[tscii:4d552780dd]
ơ ơ ɢ ɧ Ǣ!

- ĢǢ -


Ţ !
!

- ĢǢ -


¢ ¢ θ š Ţ𧼡, ¡ !
¡ !

///

( Ǹ , ɢ. 5: Ũ .)


[/tscii:4d552780dd]

Oldposts
30th January 2005, 02:05 PM
Dear Reader,
Even though I have many TSCII Fonts installed in my Computer, I am still unable to read your above response in Tamil. Please advise me of the Font used.

[tscii:a6c50222a3]<font color="#FF0080"> §,
측 째¢Ǣ Šվ Ƣ¢, Ƣ
Ȣ즸 Ƣ ,
* â Ȣ즸 -
ռ ž - Ƣ¢
Ũ , *ɢ .

*󿢨 šž ȡ *.
* ռ . ӨԼ
Ƣ ̨ Ţ.
[/tscii:a6c50222a3]</font>

Use TSC_Avarangal Tamil Font to read the above

Oldposts
30th January 2005, 02:05 PM
[tscii:95ff722b56] ¡ 񧼡? 60 Ģ... , 쨸, Ţ â,
¡ ؾɡ š¢, Ƣ¢ ը ç. Ƹ Ƹ ȡ.
.. .
[/tscii:95ff722b56]

Oldposts
30th January 2005, 02:05 PM
You can use any TSCII font to read in Tamil

Oldposts
30th January 2005, 02:05 PM
In order for Tamil to continue as a kiving labguage Tamil should be developed for use in business and education also. Indian Government makes a concerted effort to block it while trying to develop Hindi in these areas poring 100s of millions rupeees.

Indian Government Blocks Tamil Development into the Twenty First Century
http://www.geocities.com/tamiltribune/99/0903.html (http://www.geocities.com/tamiltribune/99/0903.html
)

Oldposts
30th January 2005, 02:05 PM
Lets not blame or beg others to improve our language. We are 60 million of us. It is up to us to let of language die or grow it 10 folds.

[tscii:12f9b33faa]‘ ’[/tscii:12f9b33faa]


We ourselves need to realize that we are ignoring our mother tongue. Tamil children call their parents Daddy,mummy. We teach them English rhymes before they say ‘Amma’. We feel proud if our sons and daughters are studying in English medium,speak English fluently. Is this Hindiwallas fault. NO…its our own fault.

Oldposts
30th January 2005, 02:05 PM
<font color="#008000">Dear Adithya,
Your Statement,</font>

<font color="#FF0000">"....We ourselves need to realize that we are ignoring our mother tongue. <u>Tamil children call their parents Daddy,mummy. We teach them English rhymes before they say ‘Amma’. We feel proud if our sons and daughters are studying in English medium,speak English fluently.</u> Is this Hindiwallas fault. NO…its our own fault.</font>

<font color="#008000">is most welcome. <u>But when are our Tamils going to wake up from this "false status" illusion.</u></font>

Oldposts
30th January 2005, 02:05 PM
Adithya

The topic is of great interest to, however I cannot read a word. Do you have an english version to post.

Thank you

Oldposts
30th January 2005, 02:05 PM
Dear Fridge,

Donwload this font from

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/tscii/files/Avarangal/tscava.ttf (http://groups.yahoo.com/group/tscii/files/Avarangal/tscava.ttf
)

I am not opposed to English in any way.It is easier for many of us to convey our feelings in Tamil. I am not good in Transaction so sorry I cannot help you with that. Hope you can donwload the font and read in Tamil.

Oldposts
30th January 2005, 02:05 PM
Sorry I forgot to say that you have to install the font.

If you want to both read and write Tamil, EKalapai, donwload

http://www.tamil.net/newtamil/software/eKalappai.exe

Oldposts
30th January 2005, 02:05 PM
Dear Adithya and Everyone,
I hope you are all doing well.
I guess the only thing i have to say, as an aside, and please dont take this the wrong way, is this: the question i find myself asking is more like "will any of we humans AT ALL survive the next century?".
I'm not being funny, i do mean this concern.
If we do, i hope Tamil as well as many other cultures makes it through as well.

There's an old Chinese curse: "may you live in interesting times".... i think its happening now.

Sadly, but lovingly yours, with best wishes for peace and sister/brotherhood everywhere, you friend,-Sreekishen

Oldposts
30th January 2005, 02:05 PM
A Korean University did a substantial study on the subject and concluded that only two languages will exist in this planet a thousand years from now: they are English and Mandarin.

I am certainly not happy to accept this but do we have a choice in this fast moving globalisation era?

Paul

Oldposts
30th January 2005, 02:05 PM
[tscii:560d1830a7]

âԾ ơ,! -
ƣ âԾ, ơ!
¸ âԾ, ơ! -
š ¸, ơ!

šȡǼ .
Ģ šȡǼ .

Ƣ ơ?
Ƣ ơ?

ƣ Ƣ ơ?
Ƣ ơ?
Ƣ ơ?

Ƽ, !
ɢ Ƽ, !
Ƽ !
Ģ Ƽ, !

Ǩ¢ Ƽ, !
ġ Ƽ, !

Ƣ Ţš¡, ơ?
Ƣ Ţɡ, ơ?
Ƣ Ţ, ơ?

Ƣ ơ?
Ƣ, ơ?


///// ///// ( Ƹ , צ ɢ. צ !)

š !
!
!


Use ATC_Aarangal, if you want to read in thamiz.




[/tscii:560d1830a7]

Oldposts
30th January 2005, 02:05 PM
[tscii:d8d23c0e57]
š !
!
!


š

Ш ţ

[/tscii:d8d23c0e57]

Oldposts
30th January 2005, 02:05 PM
You people in India do not know how to play nice, i would like to read this but I cannot read Tamil.

Oldposts
30th January 2005, 02:05 PM
Ithai padithuvittu manam patha-pathaikirathu. Ippadium aka kooduma?

Oldposts
30th January 2005, 02:05 PM
Fridge,

You should start learning Tamil, if you want to read Tamil.

Transliteration and translation never conveys the same message. Literary Tamil can be difficult to understand. There are some like P.N.Kumar who write in beautiful Tamil. His Tamil is so difficult to translate in English.

You should start learning Tamil. You don't realize how much you are missing out. Tamil literature is very extensive and goes back two thousand years at least. Yes, there is an enormous corpus of Tamil literature.

Oldposts
30th January 2005, 02:05 PM
Madurai Veeran

I do realise that I am missing out on a lot, I am busy learning Tamil at present.

Nandri
Fridge

Oldposts
30th January 2005, 02:05 PM
[tscii:d658ecfa75]
þ ɡ:

¡ȢƢǢ Ƣ
ɢ
á, Ţ̸ǡ, ĸ


Ʀ
šξ ȡ? ģ!
ơ ĸġ
Ũ .

¡Ȣ â
, ;
ɢ ¡ϧ 󾾢;
á Ţǡ ռǡ
šȡ; զ ǣ!
Φɢ զ
Ƣ ţ!

ȿ Ȣ
Ƣ¢ ;
š Ҹب
Ƣ¢ ;
š
žġ ;
Ĩɢ Ǣ𧼡
Ž .

Ǣ ¢
š츢ɢ Ǣ

Ţ ¢
ţ ռġ
ŢƢ Ţ š;

Ӿ ͨŸ
.

======================


š !
!
!



(Ȣ, Ш ţ.)

////


<a name="last"></a>

[/tscii:d658ecfa75]

jackselvaraju
22nd February 2005, 10:41 PM
I personally see no reason why the TAMIL language should cease to exist in the present century.Let face the realities, Tamil survival depends largely on it`s usage by the Tamil people themselves. As rightly pointed out by fellow hubbers, the non-TAMIL speaking people are not obliged to preserve or promote the language. For them it is only a tool to conduct business like film making or plainly speaking it is used to make money for them. This is not wrong, however the Tamils cannot expect them to preserve or popularise the usage of Tamil. So the onus is for the TAMILS to consciously use the language in their daily life, which of course means in their home, place of work or worship and in their social circle.Easily said right? In actual fact Tamils are reclutant to speak their language to fellow Tamils. This trend is evident most obviously in Tamilnadu, where Tamil takes a backseat to English. To communicate in English is the in thing there, I guess due to the wide spread influence of Tamil movies and songs where the use of English words is seen as fashionable , modern and associated with the rich and educated. To them only the low educated and peasants use Tamil in their daily chore.To make matter worse, the politicians and cine field people have not done anything to enhance the usage of Tamil. I don`t blame them for most of them their mother tongue is not Tamil. Predominantly, Tamil actress, actors , singers, music directors and other technicians are not Tamil by origin. Most of them comes from neighbouring states or from the NORTH. Obviously , we cannot expect them to speak Tamil or promote it.Therefore, it is crucial Tamils worldwide seriously make all efforts to teach their children Tamil by leading by example. If their government does not extend the support, then temples or social organisation should take the lead in conductiing Tamil classes. At the end of the day, it is our profound responsibilities to maximise the usage of Tamil.At present, only Tamils in singapore, Malaysia and Sri Lanka are making some effort. In Singapore, the Institute ofEducation made the efforts to launch Tamil as the lfirst Indian language to used in the internet. Recently, Tamil was also introduce to be used as SMS in mobile phones.My only hope is that Tamils should find ways and means to use Tamil and push Tamil to the next frontier. This classsic language should never be left to perish, for it will be a untold loss to mankind. Long live Tamil.

mack
3rd March 2005, 12:35 AM
tamil will be an international language in the next year

HindustaniLadka
3rd March 2005, 12:58 AM
how?

santosh108
7th March 2005, 06:43 AM
Recently, Tamil was also introduce to be used as SMS in mobile phones

see link for information on above

http://www.murasu.com/mobile/

Well done Singapore :clap: :thumbsup:

dr#
10th March 2005, 09:23 AM
all languages evolve.....and what might be called tamil today, may be tamglish or tamdarin in 100 yrs.

Crab
12th March 2005, 12:48 AM
Yes, Tamil will die within two generations. Tamil families in Malaysia now can speak the language but not write it! Bcoz their education is in Malay only.

In Tamil Nadu, it's now possible for a child to study, graduate, get a job, buy property, vote, retire and die without learning Tamil at all, thanks to CBSE. However Hindi is compulsory in this route.

Even Kollywood is mocking at Tamil activists calling them fundamentalists. In the audio release function of Chandramuki, the veteran poet Vaali said it's not a good idea to name the film as Nila Moonji just bcoz Dr Ramadas said so.

My little cousins can't write Tamil anymore. Bcoz they have been indoctrinated that it's economically futile. They don't realise that three thousand years of proud terrific non-stop history ought to carry some meaning.

A storm is coming. Can you see it?

santosh108
12th March 2005, 07:00 AM
Tamil families in Malaysia now can speak the language but not write it! Bcoz their education is in Malay only.

Being a multi-ethnic country, Malaysia has a unique educational system. There are 3 types of primary schools depending upon the medium of instruction. These are:
(a) Malay medium national schools
(b) Chinese medium national type schools
(c) Tamil medium national type schools

Currently, there are about 530 Tamil medium primary schools in Malaysia

Culturally, Tamil schools are regarded as an important safeguard of the Malaysian Tamils heritage.

Politically, the fate of Malaysia's ethnic-based ruling parties is closely tied to the preservation of the government-aided Chinese and Tamil-medium primary schools.

Economically, not much value.

Tamil_Socrates
12th March 2005, 05:04 PM
Tamil will live for ever..

kal thondri man thondra kalathu mun thondtiya mozhi...nam tamil..

blahblah
12th March 2005, 05:42 PM
A storm is coming. Can you see it?
If a storm is coming,you've got to face it Sir,that's what I will do!

jackselvaraju
14th March 2005, 03:27 PM
Dear Crab,

I understand your concern, so what are you going to do about the decline of tamil usage within the community. have you as a responsible individual , come out with any solutions or initiatives to stop this decline? That tamil usage is declining, is solely or shortcoming. it is time for people like you and me to act. seriously consider how to reverse this trend. This internet networking tool can be tapped. Share you valuable thoughts and insights and I will follow up. Pls read my message regarding this topic, which I have posted earlier. my e mail address is jackselvaraju2004@yahoo.com thanks crab.

Crab
20th March 2005, 02:20 AM
GOOGLE TAMIL

Looks like Tamil may after all survive into the third millennium too!

Google now offers complete search engine in the oldest living commercial language of south Asia.

http://www.google.com/intl/ta/

Type the word you want to search in the Latha font which comes available in packaged Windows XP.

8)

kavithasenthil
20th March 2005, 02:27 AM
Wow.Wonderful! Meha arumai!

Crab
25th March 2005, 09:44 PM
As if we need any proof of northern dereliction of duty towards Tamil and other regional civilizations, it is now confirmed in the chief minister's budget 2005 speech that the Union Government has sanctioned only 200 million of the 600 million assistance needed for tsunami relief, rehabilitation, repairs and consequent institutional reforms.

Also, thirteen weeks after the calamity, a mere 30 million have been released till now out of the already under-sanctioned funds!

The chief minister has already sanctioned 100 million for relief and provided for a further 100 million in a tax-free budget on top of a full-fledged tsunami policy that earmarks over 200 million including insured housing!

Meanwhile TN's request for waiver of Tamil fishermen's debt is still "under consideration" by the Union Government.

[tscii:dd2a0bacf4]?[/tscii:dd2a0bacf4]

Sources:
- http://www.tn.gov.in/budget/budsph2005-06-2.htm
- http://www.hindu.com/2005/03/25/stories/2005032510910100.htm

Surya
26th March 2005, 01:29 AM
GOOGLE TAMIL

Looks like Tamil may after all survive into the third millennium too!

Google now offers complete search engine in the oldest living commercial language of south Asia.

http://www.google.com/intl/ta/

Type the word you want to search in the Latha font which comes available in packaged Windows XP.

8)

Nice!!! 8) [tscii:91fc1eb8f6] ը !!![/tscii:91fc1eb8f6] :clap:


Looks like Tamil may after all survive into the third millennium too!

[tscii:91fc1eb8f6] 󧾸 [/tscii:91fc1eb8f6] :? 8)

HindustaniLadka
26th March 2005, 05:07 AM
As if we need any proof of northern dereliction of duty towards Tamil and other regional civilizations, it is now confirmed in the chief minister's budget 2005 speech that the Union Government has sanctioned only 200 million of the 600 million assistance needed for tsunami relief, rehabilitation, repairs and consequent institutional reforms.

Also, thirteen weeks after the calamity, a mere 30 million have been released till now out of the already under-sanctioned funds!

The chief minister has already sanctioned 100 million for relief and provided for a further 100 million in a tax-free budget on top of a full-fledged tsunami policy that earmarks over 200 million including insured housing!

Meanwhile TN's request for waiver of Tamil fishermen's debt is still "under consideration" by the Union Government.

[tscii:603e165a3a]?[/tscii:603e165a3a]

Sources:
- http://www.tn.gov.in/budget/budsph2005-06-2.htm
- http://www.hindu.com/2005/03/25/stories/2005032510910100.htm

Both of the links you posted only prove that the central government is working to get as many funds as possible to the people who were affected by the Tsunami. You are complaining taht only 200 million of the proposed 600 million has been sanctioned. 200 million is a lot of money and in addition to this money, the military is providing trucks, helicopters and supplies to help our tsunami affected people.

Also, if Northerners really don't care about Tamil people, why did Vivek Oberoi adopt an entire village in TN? Why did every name in bollywood(bollywood is made up of people from every part of India) take part in a concert to raise funds for Tsunami relief in TN? Also, if the central government is out to get TN, why is the President of India from TN?

Crab
31st March 2005, 09:45 PM
WIKIPEDIA TAMIL

After Google's Tamil search engine, comes a full-fledged Tamil encyclopaedia from Wikipedia. Use Latha font to keyword search at:

http://ta.wikipedia.org

HindustaniLadka
31st March 2005, 10:08 PM
Yeah. both google and wikipedia are written in a lot of other Indian languages including Sanskrit, Telugu, Hindi, Kannada, Gujurathi, Bengali, Marathi, Urdu, Assamese, and Konkoni.

Idiappam
1st April 2005, 05:59 PM
Great, Mr HindLad. Can I have some links please!

mellon
2nd April 2005, 01:49 AM
No, you just have to take HL's words for it, as always! :lol:

aravindhan
2nd April 2005, 03:59 AM
Great, Mr HindLad. Can I have some links please!
If you go to the Tamil Wikipedia homepage (http://ta.wikipedia.org/) and scroll down a bit, you'll see a box on the left-hand side titled: "ஏனைய மொழிகள்". That has links to the other South Asian language wikipedias.

As far as google goes, go to their language tools page http://www.google.com/language_tools. Scroll down a bit, and you'll see a section titled: "Use the Google Interface in Your Language". You'll see there that they have a range of languages, including the world-renowned language "Bork! Bork! Bork!"

HindustaniLadka
2nd April 2005, 06:10 AM
Thank you aravindhan. :D


I would have posted links myself, since idiappam and mellon seem to have a hard time finding google.com and wikipedia.com, but i was away for a bit. :lol:

http://www.google.co.in/

mahadevan
16th November 2005, 02:22 AM
as of today Nov 15, 2005 google is offered in Hindi, Bengali, Telugu, Marathi and Tamil. Did I miss Sanskrit, Kannada, Gujurathi,Urdu, Assamese, and Konkoni ?

viggop
16th November 2005, 08:53 AM
I do not agree with such doomsday prophets.
They keep saying Tamil will die, carnatic music will die, Indian culture will die,Tamil panpadu will die etc.
Nothing will happen like that.We need not worry and Tamil ,carnatic music,culture will live for a long long time into the future. :-)

zz
16th November 2005, 03:04 PM
Swami Vivekanand speaks on antiquity of Tamil and its importance in Indian culture.

from " complete works of Swami Vivekananda, Volume 4 " chapter - "Aryans and Tamilians"


Swamiji speaks on:


1. Why the Brahmins( men of knowledge ) are considered as highest in the social order of India , and not Kshatriyas ( Kings and warriors) as in all other european countries.


2. Then a bit of explanation on the caste system and mention that it was not on birth.


3. Then problems created brahmins arrogance and appeal to all brahmins and non-brahmins to rise towards the right ideals then to fight over between themselves.


4. Then a firm disapproval of the Aryan theory and a message to bridge the north - south differences and He says " even taking for granted that both these grand sub-divisions of Indian humanity came from outside the Western frontier" ( Both here implies corrupted-caste system and north-south divisions) and an appeal to rise out of this false notion .


5. Finally, a good article to be read slowly and in the right earnest




Aryans and Tamilians

By Swami Vivekananda

From: The Complete Works of Swami Vivekananda , Volume 4 , Pg.296

http://www.ramakrishnavivekananda.info/vivekananda/volume_4/vol_4_frame.htm


A veritable ethnological museum! Possibly, the half ape skeleton of the recently discovered Sumatra link will be found on search here, too. The Dolmens are not wanting. Flint implements can be dug out almost anywhere. The lake-dwellers-at least the river-dwellers must have been abundant at one time. The cave-men and leaf-wearers still persist. The primitive hunters living in forests are in evidence in various parts of the country. Then there are the more historical varieties-the Negrito Kolarian, the Dravidian, and the Aryan. To these have been added from time to time dashes of nearly all the known races, and a great many yet unknown-various breeds of Mongoloids, Mongols, Tartars, and the so-called Aryans of the -philologists. Well, here are the Persian, the Greek, the Yunchi, the Hun, the Chin, the Scythian, and many more,- melted and fused, the Jews, Parsees, Arabs, Mongols, down to the descendants of the Vikings and the lords of the German forests, yet undigested-an ocean of humanity, composed of these race-waves seething, boiling, struggling, constantly changing form, rising to the surface, and spreading, and swallowing little ones, again subsiding-this is the history of India.

In the midst of this madness of nature, one of the contending factions discovered a method and, through the force of its superior culture, succeeded in bringing the largest number of Indian humanity under its sway.

The superior race styled themselves the Aryas or nobles, and their method was the Varnashramacharathe so-called caste. Of course the men of the Aryan race reserved for themselves, consciously or unconsciously a good many privileges ; yet the institution of caste has always been very flexible, sometimes too flexible to ensure a healthy uprise of the races very low in the scale of culture.

It put, theoretically at least, the whole of India under the guidance-not of wealth, nor of the sword-but of intellect-intellect chastened and controlled by spirituality. The leading caste in India is the highest of the Aryans - the Brahmins.

Though apparently different from the social methods of other nations, on close inspection, the Aryan method of caste will not be found so very different except on two points:

The first is, in every other country the highest honour belongs to the Kshatriya-the man of the sword. The Pope of Rome will be glad to trace his descent to some robber baron on the banks of the Rhine. In India, the highest honour belongs to the man of peace- the Sharman, the Brahmin, the man of God.

The greatest Indian king would be gratified to trace his descent to some ancient sage who lived in the forest, probably a recluse, possessing nothing, dependent upon the villagers for his daily necessities, and all his life trying to solve the problems of this life and the life hereafter. The second point is, the difference of unit. The law of caste in every other country takes the individual man or woman as the sufficient unit. Wealth, power, intellect, or beauty suffices for the individual to leave the status of birth and scramble up to anywhere he can.

Here, the unit is all the members of a caste community. Here, too, one has every chance of rising from a low caste to a higher or the highest: only, in this birth-land of altruism, one is compelled to take his whole caste along with him.

In India, you cannot, on account of your wealth, power, or any other merit, leave your fellows behind and make common cause with your superiors ; you cannot deprive those who helped in your acquiring the excellence of any benefit therefrom and give them in return only contempt. If you want to rise to a higher caste in India, you have to elevate all your caste first, and then there is nothing in your onward path to hold you back.

This is the Indian method of fusion, and this has been going on from time immemorial. For in India, more than elsewhere, such words as Aryans and Dravidians are only of philological import, the so-called craniological differentiation finding no solid ground to work upon.

Even so are the names Brahmin, Kshatriya, etc. They simply represent the status of a community in itself continuously fluctuating, even' when it has reached the summit and all further endeavours are towards fixity of the type by non-marriage, bv being forced to admit fresh groups, from lower castes or foreign lands, within its pale.

Whatever caste has the power of the sword, becomes Kshatriya ; whatever learning, Brahmin ; whatever wealth, Vaishya.

The groups that have already reached the coveted goal, indeed, try to keep themselves aloof from the newcomers, by making sub-divisions in the same caste, but the fact remains that they coalesce in the long run. This is going on before our own eyes, all over India. Naturally, a group having raised itself would try to preserve the privileges to itself. Hence, whenever it was possible to get the help of a king, the higher castes, especially the Brahmins, have tried to put down similar aspirations in lower castes, b'y the sword if practicable. But the question is: Did they succeed? Look closely into your Puranas and Upa-puranas, look especially into the local Khandas of the big Puranas, look round and see what is happening before your eyes, and you will find the answer.

We are, in spite of our various castes, and in spite of the modern custom of marriage restricted within the sub divisions of a caste (though this is not universal), a mixed race in every sense of the word.

Whatever may be the import of the philological terms "Aryan" and "T'amilians:", even taking for granted that both these grand sub-divisions of Indian humanity came from outside the Western frontier, the dividing line had been, from the most ancient times, one of language and not of blood. Not one of the epithets expressive of contempt for the ugly physical features of the Dasyus of the Vedas would apply to the great Tamilian race ; in fact if there be a toss for good looks between the Aryans and Tamilians, no sensible man would dare prognosticate the result.

The super-arrogated excellence of birth of any caste in India is only pure myth, and in no part of India has it, ,we are sorry to say, found such congenial soil, owing to linguistic differences, as in the South.

We purposely refrain from going into the details of ;his social tyranny in the South, just as we have stopped ourselves from scrutinising the genesis of the various modern Brahmins and other castes. Sufficient for us to is evident Madras note the extreme tension of feeling that between the Brahmins and non-Brahmins of the Presidency.

We believe in Indian caste as one of the greatest social institutions that the Lord gave to man. We also believe that though the unavoidable defects, foreign persecutions, and, above all, the monumental ignorance and pride of many Brahmins who do not deserve the name, have thwarted, in many ways, the legitimate fructification of this most glorious Indian institution, it has already worked wonders for the land of Bharata and is destined to lead Indian humanity to its goal.

We earnestly entreat the Brahmins of the South not to forget the ideal of India-the production of a universe of. Brahmins, pure as purity, good as God Himself: this was at the beginning, says the Mahabharata, and so will it be in the end.

Then anyone who claims to be a Brahmin should prove his pretensions, first by manifesting that spirituality, and next by raising others to the same status. On the face of this, it seems that most of them are only nursing a false pride of birth ; and any schemer, native or foreign, who can pander to this vanity and inherent laziness by fulsome sophistry, appears to satisfy most.

Beware, Brahmins, this is the sign of death! Arise and show your manhood, your Brahminhood, by raising the non-Brahmins around you-not in the spirit of a master -not with the rotten canker of egotism crawling with superstitions and the charlatanry of East and West-but in the spirit of a servant. For verily he who knows how to serve knows how to rule.

The non-Brahmins also have been spending their energy in kindling the fire of caste hatred--vain and useless to solve the problem-to which every non-Hindu is only too glad to throw on a load of fuel.

Not a step forward can be made by these inter-caste quarrels, not one difficulty removed; only the beneficent onward march of events would be thrown back, possibly for centuries, if the fire bursts out into flames.

It would be a repetition of Buddhistic political blunders.


In the midst of this ignorant clamour and hatred, we are delighted to find Pandit D. Savariroyan pursuing the only legitimate and the only sensible course. Instead of wasting precious vitality in foolish and meaningless quarrels, Pandit Savariroyan has undertaken in his articles an the "Admixture of the Aryan with Tamilian" in the Siddhcinta Deepika, to clear away not only a lot of haze, created by a too adventurous Western philology, but to pave the way to a better understanding of the caste problem in the South.

Nobody ever got anything by begging. We get only what we deserve. The first step to deserve is to desire; and we desire with success what we feel ourselves worthy to get.

A gentle yet clear brushing off of the cobwebs of the so-called Aryan theory and all its vicious corollaries is therefore absolutely necessary, especially for the South, and a proper self-respect created by a knowledge of the past grandeur of one of the great ancestors of the Aryan race-the great Tamilians.

We stick, in spite of Western theories, to that definition of the word "Arya" which we find in our sacred books, and which includes only the multitude we now call Hindus. This Aryan race, itself a mixture of two great races, Sanskrit-speaking and Tamil-speaking, applies to all Hindus alike. That the Shudras have in some Smritis been excluded from this epithet means nothing, for the Shudras were and still are only the waiting Aryas-Aryas in novitiate.

Though we know Pandit Savariroyan is walking over rather insecure ground, though we differ from many of his sweeping explanations of Vedic names and races, yet we are glad that he has undertaken the task of beginning a proper investigation into the culture of the great mother of Indian civilisation-if the Sanskrit-speaking race was the father.

We are glad also that he boldly pushes forward the Accado-Sumerian racial identity of the ancient Tamilians. And this makes us proud of the blood of the great civilisation which flowered before all others--compared to whose antiquity the Aryans and Semites are babies.

We would suggest, also, that the land of Punt of the Egyptians was not only Malabar, but that the Egyptians as a race bodily migrated from Malabar across the ocean and entered the delta along the course of the Nile from north to south, to which Punt they have been always fondly looking back as the home of the blessed.

This is a move in the right direction. Detailed and more careful work is sure to follow with a better study of the Tamilian tongues and the Tamilian elements found in the Sanskrit literature, philosophy, and religion. And who are more competent to do this work than those who learn the Tamilian idioms as their mother-tongue?

As for us Vedantins and Sannyasins, we are proud of our Sanskrit-speaking ancestors of the Vedas ; proud of our Tamil-speaking ancestors whose civilisation is the oldest yet known ; we are proud of our Kolarian ancestors older than either of the above-who lived and hunted in forests; we are proud of our ancestors with flint implements-the first of the human race; and if evolution is true, we are proud of our anaifial ancestors, for they antedated man himself. We are proud that we are descendants of the whole universe, sentient or insentient. Proud that we are born, and work, and suffer-prouder still that we die when the task is finished and enter for ever the realm where there is no more delusion.


"What India wants is a new electric fire to stir up a fresh vigour in the national veins"-Swami Vivekananda



"Study of the Truth and its dissemination is the duty of every Indian."-Swami Chinmayananda

Uthappam
21st November 2005, 03:49 AM
Will tamil survive the next century?? Very good question!

Wait and see!

honey bee
22nd November 2005, 05:40 PM
Will tamil survive the next century?? Very good question!

Wait and see!
Any Idea to celebrate the New Year Eve, 31. 12. 2099? I would like to join you, does not matter where, in Heaven or Hell. :lol:

mahadevan
22nd November 2005, 11:54 PM
When you lose your language you lose your culture/tradition, Our culture/Tradition/Language all have survived for thousands of years, a century is a ghughupee :-)

Sanguine Sridhar
23rd November 2005, 12:10 AM
Tamil will survive..but more english and other languge dominated!

F.S.Gandhi vandayar
12th December 2005, 10:47 AM
Tamil taught as subject in 20 countries

"Govt. interested in opening film cities, not library cities"

Thanjavur: Tamil is taught as a subject in twenty countries, said Tamil writer Mathalai Somu here recently.

Speaking at the Library Week celebrations organised by the Department of Library and Information Science at Sri AVVM Pushpam College at Poondi, near here, Mr. Somu said that Tamil broadcast is done in radio and TV in yet another twenty countries.

Tamil people were living in 40 countries. With respect to website, Tamil occupies the second place next to English.

Mr. Somu said that libraries were more in number in countries like Norway, Denmark and Australia.

"There are two libraries in a street in those countries. Readers are also more in number. In our country, Government shows interest in establishing film cities and not library cities," regretted Somu.

K. Thulasiah Vandayar, Correspondent and secretary of the college, said that students should make best use of the libraries. Vivekananda at the age of twenty toured various countries and taught spirituality. S. Balu, Principal of the college, welcomed the gathering.

COURTESY : THE HINDU

f.s.gandhi

stranger
15th December 2005, 04:42 AM
When you lose your language you lose your culture/tradition, Our culture/Tradition/Language :-)

That is interesting point!

Kushboo challenges:

How many men in TN never slept with any women before their marriage?!

All she is trying to say is:

All Tamil men have premarital relationship. So, she is encouraging all the women to carry a condom-pack in their purse. In case they want to get laid in an unavoidable situation?! They can save them from AIDS and there is nothing wrong in being a SLUT, kushboo assures bbased on her experience!

When people condemned that:

Another, actress namely Suhashini is saying:

Do Tamils have Horns???!!!

So according to Suhashini, if one never had premarital sex and concerned about the Kushboo's statement, he/she should be having a Horn!

So, what are they really suggesting???!!!!

Carrying condom in purse and wallet is not Thamizh culture! Getting laid wherever you wnat and with whomever you want is also not Thamizh culture!

Are they spitting at Tamil culture as they happened to be a slut becuase of their profession???! :twisted:

F.S.Gandhi vandayar
15th December 2005, 02:25 PM
Tamils had 'Polygamy' (practice of men having more than one wife in culture and not 'Polyandry"(practice of female havinv more than one husband)

Silapathikaaram-epic And some sankam literature show polygamy. Scientists says there is no problem with polygamy. In fact it is healthy for men. No heart attack :!: No Diabetics :!: In Saudi Arabia ancient tamil culture still followed with polygamy. No problem.

Polyandry is Vedhic Culture- North Indian culture. Mahabharatha Kunthi Devi , Throwbathi (both wife of five persons) and more portray this. It spread diseases.

Kushboo is from North India. No wonder to see her supporting Polyandry.

Polyandry spreads AIDS. Polyandry collapses social harmony.

'Manusmirithi' -the sacred book says and supports ladies if they don't yield child they can mate with nearest relatives. The first & worst propogator of "Braaththall"/ Sex labour.

Where tamil epics including Thirukkural talks about Ladies 'Karpu' and condemns "Varaivin Mahalir"- Sex labour.

f.s.gandhi

stranger
15th December 2005, 08:56 PM
No society is perfect. And Tamils are no exception!

There are prostitutes, illegal affairs, premarital and extramarital sex exist. Nobody can deny that.

Nevertheless, what trashes like Kushboo and Sugashini should be taught is:

"nallaar oruvar uLarEnum avar poruttu ellOrukkum peyyum mazhai"

Kushboo and Sugashini can live whatever life they wish. As long as their husbands are "braod-minded" and ready to accept multiple partner relationship, they can even do that even today. Nobody cares.

But Kushboo or Suhashini or any trash DOES NOT have any right to question the integrity of "good people" or their beliefs in chastity and virginity.

Lambretta
16th December 2005, 08:42 AM
Indha thread engendhu enge-ku poyinduku.......! :? :roll:

Surya
16th December 2005, 09:22 AM
Kushboo is from North India. No wonder to see her supporting Polyandry.

R u serious!? :banghead: This is one of the worst generalizations ever! You can find the worst slut in the south, and the modern day Sitha in the North! (Not generalizing about southies or northies.)


Polyandry spreads AIDS. Polyandry collapses social harmony.

So does Polygamy!! The HIV Virus doesn't only seek out couple who practice polyandry! Society has accepted Polyandry! That's all! Societ had also once accepted rituals like Sati, Practice of things like Untouchability, Murdering female babies, Sacrifices of animals, so on and so forth. The Acceptance for Men having mulitiple wives is also the same!


In Saudi Arabia ancient tamil culture still followed with polygamy. No problem.

Saudi Arabia also happens to be one of the biggest Human Rights Violators in the world!!

* Periyar said that "Karpu" should be maintained by both sexes!

* "Karpu nilai yendru solla vanthal, iru katchikkum athai pothuvil vaippom!" - Mahakavi Subramaniya Bharathy.

It's male chauvenism to say that the rules of chastity only applies to women and not men! Both sexes should follow this sort of lifestyle! If it doesn't apply to men, then it doesn't apply to women either!

mahadevan
17th December 2005, 12:55 AM
Men Or Women 'oruvanuku oruthi' and 'Orithiku Oruvan' that is the quintescence of our culture, polygamy/polyandry is a deviation driven by male/female domination or unbalanced sex ratio.
Men, Women with Children is a family.

Both polygamy and polyandry can spread AIDS faster if the participants stray away and screw around. How is polygamy better than polyandry with HIV ?

Let us accept the fact that North Indian cities like Mumbai are much more westernized (adopted just the bad part of it) than chennai, Kushboo is from there and the company that she had in chennai is all cinema crowd where screwing around is the norm, so Kushboo who is completly ignorant of the real Tamil culture (not to say that all tamil people are cultured) thought that all tamil people are like her cinema freinds and made such a statement. This is infact wrong, but once she apologised for the same, we should stop it there.

Let us talk about Tamil in the next milenium oops century.

stranger
17th December 2005, 04:46 AM
In fact it is healthy for men. No heart attack :!: No Diabetics :!:
f.s.gandhi

:rotfl:

Azhahan
17th December 2005, 05:04 PM
It's male chauvenism to say that the rules of chastity only applies to women and not men! Both sexes should follow this sort of lifestyle! If it doesn't apply to men, then it doesn't apply to women either!

Hats off to Surya!

May I ask for your day of ordination? If only the world is full of such philosophers I would have already started an enterprise for chastity belts.

F.S.Gandhi vandayar
17th December 2005, 06:06 PM
stranger wrote :No society is perfect. And Tamils are no exception!

There are prostitutes, illegal affairs, premarital and extramarital sex exist. Nobody can deny that.

Surya wrote : R u serious!? This is one of the worst generalizations ever! You can find the worst slut in the south, and the modern day Sitha in the North! (Not generalizing about southies or northies.)


I agree the above views :) It is the matter of percentage :!: My point is to find out the root cause of such happenings in society. Rules & Regulations vary country to country & time to time. Socio-Economical conditions plays major role.

Culture & its effect plays very important role. As a history observer I wanted to indicate the history & culture which initiated such notions among people.

The intake & display of people's mentality of particular habitual morality depends on this historic perspective. Perhaps Social ramifications led to different habituations :!:

All we can justify about the quality of such morality is how much benefits that the society gets out of it / whether society's health is affected or not.

Now, the Indian population is more than 100 crores. 100 years ago it was 30 crore. And 2000 years ago it must be around some lakhs.

In present situations 'Polygamy' may lead to severe social & economical repercussions and unharmonius life among masses if not unhealthy practices particulary in India.

Scholar MaraimalaiAdikal welcomes & defends for 'Polygamy' in sankam period in his book 'Tamilar Matham' due to its natural proportions.

In ancient Tamil society one male used to marry three (not more than that :!: ) females of same family for marital relationship. When a lady yield a child he would leave her for five years to take child growth. Naturally, The concentration of that lady would be in caring her child not the husband as we can see in other animals (Men are social animals).

So husband's torture immediately after giving birth to a child is eliminated for a lady :!: During this time he mates with second lady and so on. Most of the jobs are agriculture & war oriented and so this was considered as healthy to both husband & wives.

In spite of these, ladies were given equal rights. They could become a 'Sanyasi' or remain bachelor (for service as in tamil epic Manimakalai) by adapting any religion. It must be borne in mind that there were 27 lady poets (poetesses) in sankam era :!:

If any husband died a young lady was allowed to remarry. This is still followed in Tamil Adidravida and Warring communities like Kallars of Ramanaathapuram district of tamil Nadu.

But in Vedhic culture everything is opposite. There is no remarriage. Manusmirithi portrays females as 'Saaththans' (Papap piravikal). It says, 'Sutraas & Women should not be allowed to read Sacred books / learn education. It also says,' Women should rely on men viz. father, husband & son and should not have self views & decisions.' Their job is to yield babies. Khajuravo' temple is a very good example for Vedhic culture of Polyandry.

To make women relieving out of this treacherous work 'Thanthai Periyar' spells women's emancipation. He talks about agreement (marriage) and both husband & wife should strict to their agreement. Either husband or wife violates this means injurious to societal harmony & healthy. Here he says, Karpu is for both of them. He tells that If they have varying views after marriage they can close the agreement and come out of this marriage arrangement (freedom). Women should not be a machine of yielding babies. He also advises women to wear dress codes as men so that they should not think themselves that they are for babies. He also forecasted test tube babies (Before 70 years from now when test tube babies were not known & not even taken for research :!: ) and advised women to have one or two children.

He also insists that Young widows should have remarriage. Otherwise they may become sex labour & Society should approve & accredit Widow marriage.

Here the topic is extra marital relationship. My point here is polygamy is worthwhile with some societal conditions till it will not violate others marriage arrangement (this means two marriage arrangement should not clash) and Polyandry is disastrous by all means.

Thiruvalluvar says," if a woman has karpu and no one in the world shall have strength & power to overturn her". Here we must note that he does not say woman only should have karpu. 'Karpu Vazkai' in sankam era was marriage life and strict rule in adherence with marriage. When a lady / man violates this she/he was considered as lady / men without 'Karpu'.

Tamil means tamil culture and this discussion is somewhat, I think, suitable to the topic and I can say that tamil culture never harm society of world as a whole.

F.S.Gandhi vandayar
18th December 2005, 12:13 PM
SURYA WROTE :

Saudi Arabia also happens to be one of the biggest Human Rights Violators in the world!!

I don't know in what sector that you want to indicate of such violations.

Though new to Saudi Arabia, I can be able to understand the culture and religious values that Saudhis follow.

They do prayers five times a day compulsorily in order to surrender to supreme being. This signifies that all are equal before god and no one is supreme in front of god. This is something like Manikavasakar's "meyyari nilai" concept. It must be borne in mind that Mohammad Nabi derived his religion from "Jent Avesta" (Majesta / tamil Maayam) as a refined one.

"Any citizen if done crime that is proved in court should be punished"- is Quran. They follow this. They have population of 2 crores only. (Compare India with same size of land -100 Crores) They have reserve of Petroleum and Gold for the next 100 & 150 years respectively. They gave all necessary basic needs of food, housing & education to every citizen of their country free of cost. If anybody do crime and it should be severely dealt with because no need of doing crime in this situations.

50 years ago every Saudi was roaming guy with no job. But they continuously followed Nabi's words in their culture. Petrol reserves made them wealthy people. Perhaps God's grace helped them.

But in India there are socio- economic problems behind every crime. In this context the real cause of doing a crime may contain a justification from the point of crime initiator / doer. In this context 'death penalty' can be considered as human violation.

Nabi did not say Ladies should be uneducated & should not go for jobs. He said Ladies should take care of domestic activities where men should go for material / worldly acquirements. Saudis marry more than one girl to normalize the wealth distribution since the men / women ratio is too less and most of men died in yesteryear wars.

The dress code is not only for women but also to men and both of them should cover all parts of body except face and this is followed in Saudi Arabia. The woman / man should show their attractive organs only to her / his husband / wife and none other to world. This way they protect the dignity of man / lady' s human values.

But in western culture everything is marketed including the body parts and no developing country like India is ruled out from this and mere exploitation of Ladies is carried out in the name of modeling career which is something we have to realize. The chance of Eve teasing will be lesser in the case of Sariyat dress than westernized open dress.

Any fundamentalism has its own drawbacks and Saudis also have this drawbacks because of strict adaptation of 'Shariyath law' and no advancement in science.

In Gulf countries slowly they transform to Democratic pattern under kings rule. Yemen is a good example. Locan counsils election is done democratic way in Saudi Arabia also.

Culturewise they adapt ancient values and no way they are lower in par with Western culture.

f.s.gandhi

gaddeswarup
12th January 2006, 03:18 AM
In the book "The Collapse of globalism" by J.R.Saul, there are some passing remarks about video games which may be useful in the preservation of languagess (see page 243):

"Look today at an apparently minor phenomenon-the evolution of video
games- and you will see how far they have gone beyond mere distraction. Suddenly, for better or worse, they have become training mechanism for everything from cooking to assassinations. Here is a wonderful tool for reviving minority languages. But the same method is a highly effective and hard-to-control tool for revival of nationalism-jingoism- at its worst. At almost no cost, these games can reach hundrends and thousands of people, particularly young, carrying messages that effortlessly blend fantasy..."

rajraj
20th February 2006, 11:14 PM
INTERNATIONAL MOTHER LANGUAGE DAY - 21 FEBRUARY

21st February was declared International Mother Language Day by UN due to the efforts of Bangladesh.

For more on the day:

http://www.un.org/depts/dhl/language/

http://www.sdnbd.org/21st_february.htm